ORIGINAL: dpms

Crossfork,

You make some great points as well, and I respect your opinion on what you feel archery equipment is and what archery hunting is about. 

I have no problem with that and thanks for the civil discussion.

Like I said before, I hunt with both and see no reason why that would change.  For me, it is just another toy.

I just try to keep the misconceptions and assumptions accounted for. 

You know, something else I should have said.

I think it's fair to say that people gravitate to bow hunting from rifle hunting for the challenge.  They are looking for something more in the chase.........more gratification for making an already tough process (bagging a deer) even tougher so the success is all the sweeter.

That's why I hesitate with crossbows, because as in everything else in life, a certain segment will deem it easier, a shortcut per say, and in my opinion that cheapens the sport.  Makes more $ for the game commission but cheapens the sport.

I guess you can say x-gun hunting is still more of a challenge than real gun hunting and that should be worth something, and I guess it is, but to me it still cheapens the whole sport.

It would be like someone coming up with a new mechanized fly rod that by pushing a button, it delivered the fly to the exact spot you wanted it without any other effort or thinking on the part of the person holding the rod. No casting motion, no other worries just push a button and that fly went to where you are aiming it.  If we started seeing those contraptions on fly-fishing water can you imagine the discussion?

Fair enough Crossfork.  We all hunt for different reasons in different seasons.  To me, I enjoy hunting and started archery hunting long ago just because I enjoy hunting too much to not be in the woods.
 
I have grown to love archery and would prefer to tag my deer in that season. 
 
As I said before, archery to me is about outwitting the quarry on its home turf up close and personal.  That is the greatest challenge and that is why I enjoy it.  My choice of archery weapon does not cheapen my experience.
 
If I need to fill my tag with my 300 Winnie, I will be satified with that accomplishemnt too.  Every season has its challenges and we all must hunt they way we choose to and not get so wrapped up in how others choose to do it as long as it is ethical and legal. 

I don't think it will have much affect on the herd.If they have no effort to learn to shoot a vertical then they probably won't have no effort to hunt.Another thing is i know a guy how owns a bow shop an got a doe kill on video at 93 yards with complete pass through.So if he can shoot that far with a vert then what's the difference?Correct me if i'm wrong but i do believe that a vert has more kinectic energy at further range then a crossbow.I never saw the video yet i don't think he  would lie he's also a competiton shooter.You said you didn't see that many deer jlh this year so how many would of you killed a deer if you used a crossbow or a vert?Crossbow or vert you got to have patience to kill deer with either or.

ORIGINAL: chicken27

I don't think it will have much affect on the herd.If they have no effort to learn to shoot a vertical then they probably won't have no effort to hunt.Another thing is i know a guy how owns a bow shop an got a doe kill on video at 93 yards with complete pass through.So if he can shoot that far with a vert then what's the difference?Correct me if i'm wrong but i do believe that a vert has more kinectic energy at further range then a crossbow.I never saw the video yet i don't think he  would lie he's also a competiton shooter.You said you didn't see that many deer jlh this year so how many would of you killed a deer if you used a crossbow or a vert?Crossbow or vert you got to have patience to kill deer with either or.

 
 
Man I must be stupid then.I didn't realize bows could reach out 90 yrds.That is absolute nonsence..
 
The man that shot at a deer with any kind of bow at 90+ yards should not be in the woods..He would have to be an absolute moron...

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remove the @ symbol

Sending it now.  It's for a new line of fly rods I'm rolling out early 09.  I see tremendous market potential.  The graphics are a little rough but you'll get the point.  Once the cash rolls in I can upgrade to a fancy picture like all those x-guns do.  Maybe even have a swimsuit model holding it!

Here it is....CrossForkWookie's X-Rod!
 

ORIGINAL: CrossForkWookie

I'm thinking of rolling this out at a special introductory rate of $99.99 for fiberglass or $299.99 for graphite.

 
When you roll them out let me know.  I am always looking for another tool for the shed.

I think there are better ways to go about it than a full inclusion..
 
Maybe the first 2-3 weeks of archery too test the waters...
 
Maybe they could make it easier for the older gents(I'm getting there) to get a permit to use one. I have heard a few say their fathers may hunt again if they were legal..That would be one of the positives.
 
You may pick up a few kids..I'm split there..We need the recruits into hunting..
 
But something sticks in my craw about very young kids with no license(formal training) being able to use them..And no revenue from them..Which we need..
 
I think we will pick up a few new archery tag sales. But to me alot of those may be the hunters that have not wanted to take the time and effort that it takes to shoot a bow accurately..
 
I think that they are more accurate just for the fact you can rest them on something..Alot of fellas say they can shoot 4" groups at 50 yrds..Wish I was that tight with my bow..And I've spent 20 years shooting bow, 3-D shoots all summer so I'm on top of my game..
 
Guess I feel like it diminishes the time I've spent to try to be a good shot as they can get that kind of accuracy with out the commitment..
 
But with this accuracy comes one of my biggest fears..Just because you can hit a target at 50 yards doesn't mean you should shoot deer that far..Some fellas will try to shoot them to far..
 
Another possible positive and I'll have to go brush my teeth after this cause it's going to be like eating a $hit sandwich..
I agree with Doc that there is a segment of hunters that use the bow and they $uck.
They don't practice and aren't skilled enough to make good ethical shots.
There equipment is junk.These few give archery a black eye.
The "horz" may make them a better shot there by a few less wounded deer..
 
I also think it will have a some what bigger affect here where I live because of the number of Amish hunters here.
Not bashing them.. They field many more hunters per household than we Yankees do..Every Amish household fields some hunters.
Where as over all hunter numbers are declining the Amish population in PA has doubled since 1996..Puts alot of pressure on the deer here.  
I think they will mostly all got to "horz" as they are easier to learn to shoot.
 
I don't know why liscence increases aren't tied to inflation..They should go up every few years to keep up..If they weren't so cash strapped they may be able to make wiser descisions instead of doing what ever they can to stay afloat...
 
 
 
 
 

I didn't believe it myself either he never brought the video down yet.How far is to far with a vert?I understand that guys will think they can shot further with a crossbow but there guys that do the same with a vert.Must spots i hunt u can't shoot over 30 yards and that's pushing it.

ORIGINAL: bingsbaits



You may pick up a few kids..I'm split there..We need the recruits into hunting..

But something sticks in my craw about very young kids with no license(formal training) being able to use them..And no revenue from them..Which we need..

 
In due time they will pay to hunt....

 The crossbow's high precision appeals to those who like to leave nothing to chance. Bench rest rifle shooters often fall in love with the crossbow's ability to put shot after shot in nearly the same hole at 40 yards. (When targeting crossbows shoot only one arrow at the time to keep from ruining your shafts and points.
 
The specs also give the maximun effective range on deer sized animals as 40 yards.
 
This is not to say that folks don't try at way longer distances.
 
How many compounders can one hole  consistantly at 40 yards? Sounds more like rifle accuracy to me.

Heck, the olympains shoot 3" groups at 70 yards if they want to compete. My point is that very few folks can shoot 1" groups at 40 yards with a compound but it is the norm with a scoped crossbow and rest. I can hit a pie plate regularly but shooting a 1" group would be sh-thouse luck.

ORIGINAL: gobyking

Why doesn't the PGC approve full draw holding devices for bows? From what I understand that is still illegal to use unless you have a legitimate handicap.

 
The PGC should approve darting deer and roping them to a tree for the first day.
 

We should just be able to call in an airstrike from the closest air force base.