Elk Creek @ RT 90

I noticed SRC signs at RT 90 last time I was up there eariler this fall, but they were only on the one side of the creek, is this the section that Beaver and the boys have leased on Elk where you can fish the opposite side of the creek?

i walked the whole way up from down stream to the property that is just below that section.. the section i was in was also posted but i didnt see any signs on the bank to inform me of this. the gentlemen just asked me to leave in a very pleasant manner. and told me that upstream was donny's leased property... no problems at all i just informed the fellow that i had no intentions of coming on your property, and that i wasnt trying to be a smartace but i didnt see any signs. I looked on the way back down and didnt see any along the stream.

How do you do this? 

I've run into problems in this exact section.  This fall, a guy watched me fish for ten or fifteen minutes, then fight a big fresh male for 5 minutes, and as soon as I landed it, he came down yelling at me and demanding I release the fish and leave.  I made it clear that I wanted no trouble and would be happy to leave, and was even on my way, and he kept right on.  Eventually he even demanded I give him my information (name, phone number, license number, etc.) and that's about the time I made it clear in no uncertain terms that while I was happy to leave, he was getting no such information from me.

About a month later, a guy stopped me just downstream from the rail bridge and informed me I was on private property (until then, I was under the impression that it was open to walk-in fishing up until the bend just up from the rails).  This guy was extremely polite and I appreciated it.

So when you get up to this point, you just cross to the west side and fish from there?

You CAN fish the opposite site of the SRC lease there. There is a possibility that an attempt to force you off will be made ( report it to a WCO ). You CAN also access the opposite side legally, but I could not explain it to you. The best bet would be to contact Brook Tolbert, and he can direct you as to how to access this area, as you have to be careful not to violate OTHER posted property in the process. I don't know how to access it, as there is too much equally, or more productive water to fish without going through the hassle.
 
As for the PF&BC causing the loss of the Dohler property. That is just nonsense. In fact they probabbley keep it open much longer than it might otherwise have been. It was your fellow anglers that lost this property, AND kept it from being re-opened. And the issues were not related solely on the most commonly know incident. It was also probabley the best thing to happern to that stream. More fish make it upstream than ever before. Problem is, that they also continue on beyond the border. Nothing the PF&BC can do about that. Granted there may not be any better holding water in N.Y. but the fish still go up there looking for it. They don't have stream maps.
 
I don't think Penna's fish "imprint" particularly well, regardless of where they are stocked. They seem to hit the shoreline in various spots, and cruise the shoreline looking for an opening. Lots of un-stocked "ditches" get runs. It could be that unlike other states, and the west coast, all Penna. tribs flow through the same terrain, and watershed, giving them basically the same "smell". I don't know, but I have to have a theory, and that's it.

yes i understand your points. i understand that the landowners didnt ask to have this in there back yard. yet now this is my opinion, to make a profit off of it is wrong.. if you want to post your land thats fine, and understandable. but then to make a profit off of the fish that part of our revenues help raise to stock?? come on.. i am sure that this has been gone over and over on here with the SRC.. but at least when he used the property on LT. J he (donny) stocked it himself..  I guess i just wanted to bi**h about it a bit spoonchucker, being that i was kick off of property last time i was up.. lol..

If you owned hundreds/thousands of acres, or miles of stream frontage, you may not care about folks using it. Plenty of game/fish, and you probabley will never see them. Now if you own 20-30 acres, or a couple hundred yards of stream front, it's likely to be a different story.
 
The reallity is that there are constantly more people, but no more land. As more people, own increasingly smaller tracts of land, it is only natural that they will exercise increasing control over it.

Good opionion about the "smell" spoony - I agree...

I talked to the fellow that owned the west side - (!*(years ago)*!) Things may have changed since then as stated above.  And the PP that you may have to cross to get there.  Things could change in a week for that matter.
 
I should include this - my time is limited when I do get to fish there.  There are plenty of other places to go and aviod the hastle of being kicked out.  I'd go with the sure thing.

OH God here we go again LOL

Tried  to get to the 90    acces this fall.   Ended up a little north of 90.   Green asked us very NICELY to leave .   I would like to find a good way to get to that area.  Guess I will just keep tryng new access. Met some nice people as we drove around looking for roads, landowners!  Good people!

you can fish here... you can't fish there. seems like its getting a bit out of hand. all due respect to the land owners but how are we supposed to know if we don't see signs on one side, but we can fish the other side. maybe there should be a newsletter thats mailed out. it all seems a little ridiculous to me. we just fishing!!!!!

ORIGINAL: orvis09

you can fish here... you can't fish there. seems like its getting a bit out of hand. all due respect to the land owners but how are we supposed to know if we don't see signs on one side, but we can fish the other side. maybe there should be a newsletter thats mailed out. it all seems a little ridiculous to me. we just fishing!!!!!

your incharge of the mailing list...

No exceptions???  What if the creek ran 15 yards outside your front door, your garage right along the bank, and your back patio in full view of the stream?  Eminent domain for fishing? 

Eminent domain, the taking of private property for public use.  Mike said on this forum that steelhead fishing means $9 million to Erie....If that gets threated due to the lack of access, you can bet you won't have to seek eminent domain on your own, you'll have the commonwealth of PA helping you.

First of all, the courts do not take property by eminent domain. Goverment entities, IE: local, state, or federal do that. The courts only get involved when it's challenged, and decide the validity of the State's, or landowner's claim.

Second, less than 10% of the fishable waters are posted. There is no need, and even less appetite for such action.

Third, any such action WOULD be challenged in court. (A) who do you think will bear the costs of litigation? (B) Sufficient amounts of water already lies in public hand, or have been signed into perpetual easement, to warrant the court not siding with the state.

Fourth, What do you think the results of a failed attempt would be?
 
I understand eminent domain is a government action.
If only 10% is posted, then it's less of a problem then I initially understood.
Yes, eminent domain would get challenged in court, it always does.  Governments bear the cost of litigation since they initiated the action.
Lastly, you nailed the potential problem.  A failed attempt at eminent domain likely would cause owner backlash leading to more posted land.

for crying out loud

i really can't believe the duuds that would suggest eminent domain for  FISHING AND RECREATION

FOOKING IDIOTS

..L.T.A.