ORIGINAL: kyler16

I dont defend the stocking of larger fish on a already over populated stream. I defend the fact of privatizing. I defend the ideas of cleaning up a stream. But do u think over time if not stocked with pellet heads the streams would be catching natural wild fish the size of what can be caught in the mid west?  I never once said DB was a conservationist, I said I defend his right to purchase and lease land but some people have a hard time digesting that its a god given right. 

Working in real estate, I know that more than anyone about the right to own land. As a person who owns land along a polluted stream, I know as much as anyone about the concept of owning streams.

Yes, it is a right to own land. That is a given. That right will not go away in out lifetimes. The problem with "owning streams" is that anything someone does upstream, effects everyone that lives downstream. The case with Yellow Creek comes to mind. Everything that the SRC does on their water, will change the water around them. Privatizing a stream can have severe effects since, as I said earlier, the vast majority of people do not know what is good for a stream, and dont consider what their actions will do to the water/land downstream. Streams have very delicate ecosystems. Very slight changes can cause drastic effects. this is not so much the case with land. What I do with my land, will not likely have as much effect on the land around me, as a change in the stream that runs through my land would have downstream. The stream that runs through my land is affected by AMD (acid mine drainage). There are no mines on my land, yet the stream is polluted to the point that no fish or aquatic insects can live there. At one time, there were native brookies in that stream. The stream owners above my land many years ago, opened their land up to mining. They "owned" the stream running through their land, and thier decisions ruined the same stream that runs through my land. Is that fair? They "owned" the secion of that stream running through thier land, so should that have been thier right? This is why stream ownership is being questioned so much recently....and for good reason.


You said: "But do u think over time if not stocked with pellet heads the streams would be catching natural wild fish the size of what can be caught in the mid west?"

No, I dont. If trout dont grow that large naturally here in PA, I dont want them to be stocked and fed to grow that large. If you want big non-wild fish, keep standing up for the SRC. If you would rather catch smaller, wild, smart, stream bred fish, then fight against him and stop kissing his arse.

Kyler,
I've guided and fished next to SRC water. They feed their fish, I've seen it and many others have as well. Deny it if you want, but I suggest you take the word of those of us "in the know".
 
Take a look at the pictures on the SRC site. Do they look like wild fish to you?

but then again not many people know the excellence of catchin a wild trout on a size 20 fly either. 

 
Just because a stream is capable of natural reproduction doesn't mean it is happening.  Infact, many of the wild trout in Spruce moved out to the J to just above the confluence.  You likely fished the Spruce section before SRC gobbled up the Consitine property .. or just simply enjoyed catching a fish of great size while not understanding what is happening beneath your feet. 
 
I mentioned cow crap because I'm being truthful.  It as well as fish stocking, is a problem.  It's been proven that the nigrate levels are highest where the farms are and levels lower as you go downstream.  There are NO farms along the last few miles of the stream which indicates my point of what beaver is doing..it's a fact and to think you're supporting that.  I have always failed to see a gray line between the black and white .. for SRC.
 
I guess I'd much rather be a purist or treehugger, or whatever you'd like to label me as, than being a part of the acts of DB.

".... I guess those farmers put them there for DB right?"
 
Keep talking out your a§§ K.  You make as much as sense as your new friend.

".....speak to me as an adult not like some of you with your "so called tough guy additudes" means alot"
 
Means a lot?  Mr. Beav probably isn't the guy to talk to about your emotional problems.  It has nothing to do with tough guy attitudes either, moreover the whole picture, something you're missing.  I understand and am aware that he legally can gobble up access.  Central PA had one section of Spruce to fish, most of it is toast, now.

"Ive fished those rivers, ive fished in erie.... and all the land hes owned hasnt interfered with me having a good time. the only thing that kept me havin a good time is running into people who blame donnie beaver for ruining fishing.... guess the fish I was catching were stupid.
"
 
It hasn't interfered with you because you've fished central PA for what? ... once this year.. in your life?  You've never seen was Spruce Creek was just 4/5 years ago and the hatches it produced.  Being passionate about something as such indicates that fly fishing south central PA is a big part of my life.  It's not for you, apparently.  The only thing that kept you HAVING a good time was you're lack of awareness, or lack of understanding.  Perhaps lack of caring as "long as you catch fish" attitude.  Sorta like SRC client attitudes.

Perhaps someday you'll learn that there is a "balance"  -- and learn to appreciate what little of it is left.  Maybe you'll cherish it, and want to protect it, or joins the likes of your friend, and only benefit from it, no matter what circumstances it takes.  Cracking big trout down here means one thing; native and wild fish are being killed.  I get a kick out of doing it when they are watching with smoke pouring from their ears.  Someday .. maybe you'll learn to care for the resource and its future, instead of ... as long as I'm catching fish attitude.  ..or maybe not.  Time will tell.

ORIGINAL: kyler16

I bet 90% of the people would change how they feel about him and his causes if they were given access to his club and rivers.....

 
You are right if we could all fish "his" waters we would not b!tch

..."Im looking tho at it as both sides. If I was rich and could do what ever he did to make that money and continue to make it then Id do what hes doing."
 
No .. you're only looking at it from one side .. that'd be the wallet side. 

ORIGINAL: SilverKype

Down on the espy property .. he's trying to claim the "high water" mark.  It seems to be more like the "low water" mark to me.  It won't last.  Is it still there drake?

:D

opps

I read '$92,000 to fish' and nearly threw up in my mouth!

I can't imagine paying that much...better yet, I can't imagine paying much of anything to fish...

I think my resident license and hundreds, close to thousands of dollars worth of gear/tackle is enough. That's just me though.

Guess what Kyler?  You can fit the number of times I've fished Spring Creek IN MY LIFE on ONE hand.  LOL  If fact, I live 30 feet from one of its tribs.  Never fished it.  Although .. the J is some 25 minutes away..
 
I'm able to catch beaver's fish .. so are you.  It's not as special as you think it may be.  I liked it for about 2 trips, then realized the number of fish in each hole (because of them rising for pellets), that it turned me off.  First day trouters would love it, except they can't keep them, legally. 

The people who fish spring, probably say Spring is the best, vice versa for the J..
 
I certainly wouldn't know.

Some people's kid's.....
Buy them book's, send them to school,
And they chew the dam corner's off......

ORIGINAL: kyler16

There is more to fishing central pa then spruce creek and lil J which is no longer Dbs . So why complain? cuz its keeping you away from something you once enjoyed am i right? I remember spring creek was once terrible because of some chemical spill.... but look at it now and that is stocked with some big pellet heads but I hear no one complaining there.... oh thats because its open to the public.... so there i say if u were aloud.... you wouldnt complain bout the big fish.

 
Once again Kyler, to many of us its not a matter of not being able to fish "his" water, its a matter of the problems he causes on them for the surrounding stream owners. If you read some of my previous post on this thread, you will see that I am against the PFBC, TU, the SRC and anyone else stocking over wild fish. Yes, there is at least one person complaining about "pelletheads" on other streams.
 
I have had access to the private stretches of Spruce Creek since at one time I guided there. It sickened me to see how many large bows had been stocked there. To me, it was not good fishing. Good fishing, in my mind, does not include "pelletheads".

ok, I for one thought most people were mad at him for keeping them off good waters for big fish.  and since you say you dont like pfbc, tu , or src then I can feel for you.  Ive got the pellet heads of jumbo size, and Ive got the natives in the 3-10 inch range.  I just enjoy the sport and lately have become more addicted to fly fishing so Im just getting to understand and enjoy catching a fish on a fly.  but I guess for someone whose had a life time and saw the changes from beautiful 10 inch natives to 22 inch rainbows that fight like fall fish has a right to disagree and hate.