SilverKype
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 12:29:25
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Doc's USP comment striking a nerve, Wayne ?  dpms - I thought you had more class than that. Why even bring it up ?
post edited by SilverKype - 2011/01/31 12:31:18
My reports and advice are for everyone to enjoy, not just the paying customers.
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S-10
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 12:43:53
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dpms - I thought you had more class than that. Why even bring it up ?
< Message edited by SilverKype -- 1/31/2011 12:31:18 PM > Why not? is it supposed to be some big secret for just the chosen few? 
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wayne c
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 12:50:45
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"Doc's USP comment striking a nerve, Wayne ?"
No not at all. Dont care about them one way or the other.(usp). I think your inference that im "connected" is a bit out of line. Ive never given any reason to be classed as a "liar" here, and ive stated several times im not a member, nor interested in becoming one. Im more interested in the actual topic itself and pgc's positions on it and how it is addressed, than how usp feels about it, or how you or doc feel about usp. But to address the "real" issue here, I do have a problem with our coyote "studies" not jiving with those from all other states, including those right next door. Thats just one more lie to top off the heap. It gets tiresome listening to these damage control bs attempts every time we turn around. i think it was interesting that the commissioner rightfully pointed it out. Or maybe it was just this: I also quite enjoyed the commissioner pointing out to Rosenberry that the deer harvests in his unit were continually declining over the last several years, yet the claim is stabilization for the unit and Rosenberry fumbled for an answer that didnt exist.
I strongly believe the commissioners were far less than impressed with the response. That struck YOUR nerve? lol.
post edited by wayne c - 2011/01/31 13:22:27
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wayne c
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 13:04:40
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Btw, after reviewing notes, it appears those for and against the plan at the meeting were about equal, it just seemed otherwise because the supporting cast were so "long-winded" in their testimonies lol. And like i said the usual same ol same ol antideer suspects were there. Pretty much common knowledge that those that have been ignored for a decade, most that dont support the deer plan clearly have given up on pgc being the "solution", and only address them in emails which requires little effort and less wasted time. Legislator correspondence is usually more the route taken these days. Dont know what "hush-hush" secrets dpms and kype are talking about, or what business it is personally for kype to be so concerned with secrecy... But imho, Pgcs only real chance of "redemption" in the eyes of hunters as i see it, would be the offering of 2 or 3 "sacrificial lambs" who have been problematic for many years now . As long as they are on staff, noway can they be trusted on into the future.
post edited by wayne c - 2011/01/31 13:13:33
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SilverKype
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 13:19:58
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ORIGINAL: S-10
dpms - I thought you had more class than that. Why even bring it up ?
< Message edited by SilverKype -- 1/31/2011 12:31:18 PM >
Why not? is it supposed to be some big secret for just the chosen few?
I don't know what's he's talking about.
My reports and advice are for everyone to enjoy, not just the paying customers.
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dpms
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 13:27:31
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ORIGINAL: SilverKype
dpms - I thought you had more class than that. Why even bring it up ?
?? Bring what up?? That the air is full of change. Think everyone knows that at this point.
My rifle is a black rifle
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Dr. Trout
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 13:30:33
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not sure what "NOTES" Wayne is referring ( maybe he was there ??)... But everything I have received in E-mails from folks THAT WERE THERE... shows that in reality there was very few negative speakers about the deer plan this year compared to other years..... I was surprised about how much testimony on other subjects this year.. maybe that is why there was less "deer talk" ?? Not buying Wayne's BS about people not showing up and testifing because they are fed up or have given up.. I think it's just they are NOT in the majority as some still want us to believe and testifing in person is TOTALLY different that sitting at home/work typing on a message board... as usual the stuff I have shows about 70% of the testimony ("not even" as Wayne posted)was supporting the DMP.. and even some wanting the BOC to REMOVE some of the deer stuff they put in last year..... I have notes on 25 speakers on Sunday.. and only 14 talked about deer... 9 with supportive comments and 5 with negative support comments...
post edited by Dr. Trout - 2011/01/31 13:40:02
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wayne c
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 13:39:48
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But everything I have received in E-mails from folks THAT WERE THERE... shows that in reality there was very few negative speakers about the deer plan this year compared to other years..... Doc, knock off the nonsense. Youre twisting what i said. I didnt say there were alot. I said they were "around" 50-50 which doesnt mean alot or few. It means around the same as the number of supporting it. There woulda been more, just as there had been for years...But when you are ignored, its alot easier NOT to show up. lmao. Driving 100 miles or more just aint as pleasant when you already know it will end with nonsupporters, yet again, getting kicked in the groin by pgc.
I also didnt deny that a portion supported the deer plan, and its only to be expected because it was representatives from the groups that have supported it since day 1 and make it a point to attend. Qdma... Penn fe....farm bureau.. environs.etc. etc.
Btw, Stan...."bluetick" has posted about most of the participants giving testimony on hpa. I was surprised about how much testimony on other subjects this year.. maybe that is why there was less "deer talk" ?? Naaa. Not likely. Nice try though. lol. 
post edited by wayne c - 2011/01/31 13:41:49
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Dr. Trout
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 13:44:24
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I did not see wayne had replied before I edited the first post.. my count out of 25 speakers.. only 14 mentioned deer... 9 supportive comments and 5 negative... that's not 50/50 in my book ??????
Stan's report is also available on my message board along with others as I get them posted...
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wayne c
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 13:45:44
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I think it's just they are NOT in the majority as some still want us to believe HA HA HA! 
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SilverKype
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 13:45:55
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ORIGINAL: dpms
ORIGINAL: SilverKype
dpms - I thought you had more class than that. Why even bring it up ?
?? Bring what up?? That the air is full of change. Think everyone knows that at this point.Â
Your comment on an unimaginable change. Seems I'm not the only one interpreting your comments this way.
My reports and advice are for everyone to enjoy, not just the paying customers.
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wayne c
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 13:51:31
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Interesting from the meeting: Rep Bob Godshall - PA House of Representatives
His folks back home can not understand why baiting was taken from them as ineffective - yet is being proposed for use on red tag farms.
Explained there is a tremendous amount of sanctuary in his area and bait does draw out deer.
On the WMI audit, said the LBFC was unaware that Scot Williamson was the one that developed the PA deer program.
Stated the John Eveland report pointed out many inconsistencies in the deer program and that it also pointed out many conflicts of interest of those implementing the program. Hmmmmmmmm Btw, doc, youre not telling the truth. There were some of those that mentioned "deer" that didnt say anything in support or negatively about the deer plan. But spoke of other issues in regards to deer. I dont believe you accounted for them correctly sir. Though again, there were some timber guys & other usual antideer suspects in attendance whose positions have long already been known.
post edited by wayne c - 2011/01/31 13:57:12
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Dr. Trout
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 14:03:31
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I counted everyone that I have testimony/notes on it was 14 --- mentioning deer subjects.. and 9-5 break down... show me where there was more ???? How can someone say something about deer management and not have it be positive or negative comment??? here's an example.. a guy wanted to know why the BOC removed baiting last year but this year wants to have it legal on red tag farms... I count him as a supporter of what the PGC was/is trying to do... and not supporting what the BOC did.. lots of folks mentioned for the BOC to listen to the experts.. I did not count that alone as a positive support comment unless they add more specific comments and they did do that ..
post edited by Dr. Trout - 2011/01/31 14:04:40
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S-10
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 14:05:47
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Not buying Wayne's BS about people not showing up and testifing because they are fed up or have given up.. I think it's just they are NOT in the majority as some still want us to believe and testifing in person is TOTALLY different that sitting at home/work typing on a message board... It could be because the folks testifying for the QDMA, DCNR, Farm Bureau, Audubon, and most of those other groups GET PAID for their time and/or expenses. I'll continue to write my letters and pay the postage rather then spend two days plus gas and hotel expense. I can better use that money for my Ohio deer hunt.
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Dr. Trout
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 14:17:51
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Writing letters , phone calls and E-mails is still the #1 way to get your voice heard... The guy this morning talking about the new Beaver plan.. made an interesting statement... it is in the public comment period... how many trappers, hunters, outdoorsmen etc have made a comment... TWENTY in the whole state... I have heard this time and time again from both sources at the PGC and PFBC... folks would not believe how FEW letters, comments, etc they actually receive.. this is NOT directed at anyone here in particular.. but it's easy to say you write, phone, e-mail etc.. but that does not mean you actually do.... very few actually do considering how many hunters we have... well back to the meeting I skipped the waterfowl stuff... later...
post edited by Dr. Trout - 2011/01/31 14:18:26
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S-10
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 14:28:46
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Doc--Did you catch the part where the farmers are complaining about crop damage from turkeys in the NE part of the state.
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wayne c
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 14:31:08
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I have heard this time and time again from both sources at the PGC and PFBC... folks would not believe how FEW letters, comments, etc they actually receive Hmmmm. You dont say...Here is a very recent statemen on that very topic:  :::::: "This is a difficult, time-consuming process for commissioners to find a balance in what is good for our environment and will keep our sportsmen interested in hunting," said Commissioner Jay Delaney, of Luzerne County, who is president of the board.
"We got the report from the deer- program audit [done by Wildlife Management Institute], we value the opinions of our biologists, we are weighing carefully what foresters are telling us about forest health, and we are considering the opinions expressed by sportsmen and conservation groups," he said.
"This is not a simple issue. Most commissioners are getting up-wards of 100 e-mails a week about deer management. I think we all agree that a few years ago there were too many deer. We now are seeking that ‘right number' of deer."
post edited by wayne c - 2011/01/31 14:50:09
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wayne c
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 15:02:21
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Beuhler??? Beuhler??? lol.
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dpms
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 15:28:18
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ORIGINAL: SilverKype
Your comment on an unimaginable change. Seems I'm not the only one interpreting your comments this way.
If all the changes go through that there are rumors about, two years ago most of us would never of expected that we may be at this point today. Anyway, speculation will be over tomorrow. A course will be set.
My rifle is a black rifle
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S-10
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 15:41:15
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Keep that cat in the bag DPMS, remember, loose lips sink ships. 
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DarDys
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/01/31 16:20:21
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"The guy this morning talking about the new Beaver plan.." Is that really an appropriate subject for an open meeting? With strangers no less.
The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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Dr. Trout
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/02/01 10:28:24
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Mr. Ron Weaner has been elected the new President of the BOC .... The gave preliminary approval to the 4 day Black Bear Season.. Sat, Mon, Tues, Weds....
post edited by Dr. Trout - 2011/02/01 10:35:59
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DarDys
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/02/01 10:48:57
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ORIGINAL: Dr. Trout
Mr. Ron Weaner has been elected the new President of the BOC ....
The gave preliminary approval to the 4 day Black Bear Season.. Sat, Mon, Tues, Weds....
Why, do they think all the bears that hid on Sunday may come out by Wednesday?
The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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bingsbaits
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/02/01 11:08:44
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"There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
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wayne c
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/02/01 11:47:13
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?? Bring what up?? That the air is full of change. Think everyone knows that at this point. Judging by the summaries on other boards, of the meeting that concluded today, that ive seen....so much for all the hoopla, the big secrets, and the air being "full of change" lol.  I didnt get to see much of the live stream, just caught a few minutes. did anyone else? Were there ANY changes to the deer management that actually matter or mean anything? I guess the problematic staff members have still somehow managed to avoid the ax? Im not seeing anything making pgc any more "trustworthy" then they were 3 days ago.
post edited by wayne c - 2011/02/01 11:49:07
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dpms
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/02/01 12:14:22
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ORIGINAL: wayne c
Were there ANY changes to the deer management that actually matter or mean anything?
Proposed 2A, 2F and 3? added to split season. Proposed current 4 point areas to "three up". Antlerless allocations for each WMU to be addressed at the April meeting.
post edited by dpms - 2011/02/01 12:24:09
My rifle is a black rifle
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DarDys
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/02/01 12:15:18
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The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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Esox_Hunter
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/02/01 12:21:52
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just curious, did anyone get a feel for whether or not the proposed 3 up top rule will go into effect?
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dpms
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/02/01 12:27:40
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ORIGINAL: Esox_Hunter
just curious, did anyone get a feel for whether or not the proposed 3 up top rule will go into effect?
I suspect that it will. I am trying to see how the vote went. Guessing 6-2?
My rifle is a black rifle
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S-10
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RE: January PGC Meeting.. Jan 30th =
2011/02/01 12:30:15
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just curious, did anyone get a feel for whether or not the proposed 3 up top rule will go into effect? I'd say it is 95% certain to pass. The biologists had no problem with it andnone of the BOC seemed to be against it. The only discussion was if it would lead to 2 up in the three point area and the BOC seemed steadfast that they would not approve that and the biologists also were against it. The vote was 8-0 on 3 up.
post edited by S-10 - 2011/02/01 12:31:54
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