Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny?

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SteelSlayer77
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2017/07/22 20:04:52 (permalink)

Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny?

I'm looking at buying my first boat and live on the lower Allegheny, where the lock system is near Freeport.  I'd like to get something that could get me on the water fishing both next to where I live, but also allow me to go up and fish below the Kinzua dam as well as other areas of the middle Allegheny for walleye. 
 
Everyone says only jet boats, but I was out on the Susquehanna last weekend in my friend's 16' bass boat with a 40HP prop and he navigated successfully through 1 foot of water with it, just had to raise the motor a bit till we were through it.  We caught a few walleye slow trolling in it too.  I also like that you can just beach it along the shore easily if you want and is very light.  My question is for anyone who has experience boating on the middle/lower Allegheny;  Do you think I could get buy on the middle section with a light 16' aluminum mod v bass boat and regular 40 or 50HP prop motor like that?   Also, would it be big enough for the lower section where the locks are?  I don't want to get swamped all the time by big boat traffic on the lower section either.
 
I'm stuck between getting something like the small bass boat, which might get me into both sections of the river.  Or getting a little bigger 17 - 17.5' deep v fishing boat, which sounds like I wouldn't be able to get onto the middle Allegheny with, but would work next to where I live, and might allow me to add a small kicker motor for trolling walleye through the lower section, plus get me onto bigger restricted HP lakes that the smaller bass boat might not handle as well. 
 
It's a hard decision, what do you guys think?    Any opinions or advice here would be much appreciated.
post edited by SteelSlayer77 - 2017/07/22 20:25:23
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    BeenThereDoneThat.
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/22 21:08:16 (permalink)
    I wouldn't recommend a deep V and would be skeptical even going with a modified V. I see problems in shallow water not being on plane.

    Conventional aluminium bass boats (flat bottom)require less draft at slow speeds.

    However, many mfgs now use a "reverse chine" configuration. This allows for less draft and faster plane with less HP in the larger more conventional fishing boats. The Crestliner Fishawk is one example of this style of boat.

    Use of props, anglers been doing that between Kinzua and Pittsburgh since the outboard was invented. Would be a good idea to assure your motor was fitted with the slip type prop fittings and carry a extra prop too.

    As for me, I wouldn't have a problem with outfitting a Fishawk 1750 with a 65 horse jet and running between Tionesta and Kennerdal any day of the week.

    FYI jets do love thier gasoline.


    You can purchase prop guards also. Never used one but I've talked with folks that swear by them.


    PS. River people are cool.
    post edited by BeenThereDoneThat. - 2017/07/22 21:13:15

    Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a life time. ~Anne Isabella Thackeray Ritchie (1837–1919)~
     
     
     
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    #2
    EMitch
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/22 23:30:01 (permalink)
    SteelSlayer, I live in Freeport and fish the lower pools 3,4,5,6,7, and 8 with a 16' Sylvan Backtroller with Classic 50 Merc, (45HP), and I have tiller steering. I wouldn't venture into the middle Allegheny for a few reasons. First off, I don't know anything about the river in that area, I don't know anybody who has fished those sections to educate me on where and where not to go, and I don't have money to be rebuildin' a lower unit 'cause I got into too shallow of water. I've been stuck on Pool 6, (above Clinton but below Kittanning) and it's tough gettin' out. From the mouth of Crooked Creek for at least 1/3 of a mile up river on the Ford City side is very shallow.
    The size of the boat ain't a problem and I've got enough horses (30mph) and I deal with the pleasure boaters when I have to, although the Jet Skis can be a real PITA!!
    If you're looking for a boat that's the Jack of all Trades, (master of none), you may well be better off with a Jon type boat, something wider that floats higher than a Deep V, and can handle 40 to 60 HP. Just my opinion. Regular Jon boats don't have any level floatation in them, but the bass boats like Tracker most likely do have floatation, and they're built off Jon boat principles and float a bit higher, and that means a lot when going shallow into uncharted waters.

    Never try to argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
    #3
    registered
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/23 09:08:39 (permalink)
    Steel,
    Good advise from BTDT & EMitch.
    If your fishing tastes are diverse, it's impossible to find the Swiss Army Knife of fishing boats.
    A 16ft. Roughneck with a jet would come close.
    My advise would be to put your money into a boat that will work where you'll use it the most.
    Then pick up a beater to run the rocky, shallow areas. 
    I've caught more fish from my canoe than all my boats combined.
    good luck
     
     
     
     
    #4
    SteelSlayer77
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/23 09:47:21 (permalink)
    Yeah, these posts have been helpful.  Two boats are exactly what EMitch's post is making me start to think.  To get two boats, and start with the more expensive one I can use most often close to where I live on the lower Allegheny.  Then add a cheaper smaller flat bottom boat down the road for middle Allegheny and small electric only lakes.
     
    So what do you guys think about the following rig for fishing and focusing on the lower Allegheny?  I would be targeting bass, walleye, catfish, and probably musky eventually.  Mainly focused on walleye and catfish though.  I'm thinking 17 - 17.5 foot aluminum boat (something like a Crestliner Fish Hawk 1750, Alumacraft Voyageur 175, Lund Impact 1775, or similar).  Maxed out main motor prolly 90 - 115HP for that size boat, with a 9.9HP kicker motor, and a 70 - 80# electric motor.  In either a side console or full windshield double console.  I would be towing it with a V6 mid-size truck (Tacoma).  It would be just myself and my dog fishing most of the time, or me and one other fishing buddy, but would want to be able to fit up to 2 or 3 passengers once in a while, just for a ride (3 - 4 total).   Do you guys think a rig like this would serve me well for walleye, cats, musky on the lower Allegheny?   Or what would you do differently and why?
     
    Would probably take it to some medium size lakes like aurther/willhelm/crooked creek lakes once in a while too, but mainly be fishing the lower river section from the upper lock down to downtown Pittsburgh. 
    post edited by SteelSlayer77 - 2017/07/23 10:14:33
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    BeenThereDoneThat.
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/23 10:14:27 (permalink)
    Given the boat size, you'll have no problem with your tow vehicle.

    As for a boat motor, I have the Yamaha 50 horse high thrust which puts my Fishawk 1750 easily up on plane topping out at 28 MPH (GPS) with two on board. 4 riders the speed drops to 25. I have a 15 HP kicker that produces 7.9 MPH. Both motors still have the stock aluminium props. My electric is 55 lb thrust.

    A few of the fellas here on the forum can vouch for the Fishawk performance.

    I wouldn't recommend below 50 HP abd unless you will be towing screaming kids on a rubber replica of the LocNess Monster or skiers, I would rethink the cost of a big motor.

    Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a life time. ~Anne Isabella Thackeray Ritchie (1837–1919)~
     
     
     
      Old fisherman never die; we just smell that way. 
     
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    eyesandgillz
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/27 10:08:54 (permalink)
    A Roughneck with a jet will do all that you want and you can get the prop conversion for it if you want.
    Lowe has several models in the 17' to 18' range that will let you fish all that you state, and then some.
     
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/27 18:20:52 (permalink)
    eyesandgillz
    A Roughneck with a jet will do all that you want and you can get the prop conversion for it if you want.
    Lowe has several models in the 17' to 18' range that will let you fish all that you state, and then some.
     


    Great minds.
    #8
    FishinGuy
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/29 08:56:12 (permalink)
    registered
    eyesandgillz
    A Roughneck with a jet will do all that you want and you can get the prop conversion for it if you want.
    Lowe has several models in the 17' to 18' range that will let you fish all that you state, and then some.
     


    Great minds.
    they won't get swamped when a houseboat or yacht comes down the lower Allegheny with it's nose pointed in the air throwing up a 4' wake? I used to have a 14' Carolina skiff. Was glad it was "unsinkable". Had to bail that sucker out several times.
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    eyesandgillz
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/31 10:27:27 (permalink)
    Fishinguy, 
    I would hope not, as long as you are paying attn.  Been out on my cousin's 16' on Kinzua in some pretty snotty weather with the wind gusting to 30 mph blowing up or down the lake and yeah, it was a wet ride but he managed. 
     
    For a 4' wake, you'll need to point the bow at it but, not many true 4' wakes on the rivers....
    #10
    BeenThereDoneThat.
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/31 11:14:14 (permalink)
    17' Roughneck (70hp) + 65hp jet + fuel tank (13 gal) + two adults near the stern = water over the transom.

    You can take that to the bank. Which is where you will be headed if you have no bilge pump.

    Be certain your boat dealer knows how to set up a jet rig for the river.
    post edited by BeenThereDoneThat. - 2017/07/31 11:21:58

    Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a life time. ~Anne Isabella Thackeray Ritchie (1837–1919)~
     
     
     
      Old fisherman never die; we just smell that way. 
     
    #11
    psu_fish
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/31 14:15:15 (permalink)
    Id get a center console for river running. Something like a G3 Gator Tough 18CC DLX or Roughneck 1760CC
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    BeenThereDoneThat.
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/07/31 17:43:40 (permalink)
    psu_fish
    Id get a center console for river running. Something like a G3 Gator Tough 18CC DLX or Roughneck 1760CC


    I concur.

    The wider the beam the better. Center console can be a PITA when moving about the boat.

    Tunnel hull with a min. 7' beam. ZOOM ZOOM.

    Jets are gas hogs but there ain't nothing like ridin' the river.

    River people are cool.

    Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a life time. ~Anne Isabella Thackeray Ritchie (1837–1919)~
     
     
     
      Old fisherman never die; we just smell that way. 
     
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    crawlerman2
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/08/03 08:59:37 (permalink)
    My buddy has a Harborcraft jet boat, awesome for the river up there.  We can fly through water that canoes have to get out and walk through.  We have had it out on bigger lakes and it was good there too.  I would say the only downfall is trying to dock it.  As soon as you let off the throttle it quickly turns.  If you have the cash that would be the way to go. 
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    BeenThereDoneThat.
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/08/03 13:42:36 (permalink)
    Sounds like your buddy has the "Extreme Shallow" which uses an engineered reverse chine.

    Your comment about the docking caught my eye. Of all the boats I have owned, I've noticed a difference with docking my current dingy which also incorporates a reverse chine.

    Darn thing glides across the water. Drop the power to soon when docking and it's start over, not dropping or reversing power and it's "rig for collision".

    Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a life time. ~Anne Isabella Thackeray Ritchie (1837–1919)~
     
     
     
      Old fisherman never die; we just smell that way. 
     
    #15
    EMitch
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/08/04 17:14:50 (permalink)
    BTDT, last time I was fishin' the river with my oldest in his Lund Predator, we're comin' down the river at 40mph, I'm sittin' up front on the casting deck, and my Sheetz coffee cup blows back to the back of the boat. He thought it was somethin' important and immediately cut the throttle. I nearly went out of the boat over the bow! Man, you talk about hittin' the brakes in a panic stop!

    Never try to argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
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    BeenThereDoneThat.
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    Re: Boat for Middle/Lower Allegheny? 2017/08/04 22:43:37 (permalink)
    Ha haa, I bet that left a tingly feeling. Seat belts installed now? LOL.

    I had a similar incident with my nephew. About a half mile up stream from the 8th Street Bridge in Franklin lay several large flat boulders which lay just below the surface of the water. Sometimes the water isn't quite deep enough to allow passage without dragging. Thank goodness the water wasn't any shallower or I'm pretty sure my nephew would not have returned to his seat. After that, the post was removed with the seat flat on the floor.

    Another good time, I had a console and wind screen but my passengers did not. Running full throttle through the riffles was a hoot at sunset. For me anyway, the windscreen gave me protection from da bugs. 😆

    Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a life time. ~Anne Isabella Thackeray Ritchie (1837–1919)~
     
     
     
      Old fisherman never die; we just smell that way. 
     
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