Less deer than could be and should be basically across the board regardless of deer density within those units. Some have far higher carrying capacity than others. That doesnt mean they are as they should be because they arent equal to 2g. And that also doesnt mean that there should be further reductions for no good reason.

2G? what's 2G have to do with this? As far as further reductions for no good reason are you referring to the additional doe tags that were issued in 2F this season for a WMU already suffering low deer numbers?

ORIGINAL: Dr. Trout

sorry.... BUT A HUNTER THAT HAS TO PAY TO SHOOT A DEER IS NOT IN MY VOCABULARY AS A DEER HUNTER....and definitely is not a true sportsman... IMHO.....


I have nothing against a guy that can afford to buy a deer harvest, but I sure do not want him talking to me about "deer hunting" and could care less about his opinions about "deer hunting".....

Now that is not to say I feel there is anything wrong with leasing a property to control the number of hunters ...

but again

my respect goes to those that harvest on land open to anyone that has permission or public land FIRST !! .... that's the most challenging form of deer hunting..



EDIT == well off to my soprtmen's meeting at 8pm ... til later...

Explain the differance between a farmer charging to access his land to hunt or a farmer LEASING his land for hunting ?

Exactly so you decrease the number of tags when addition days become avalible to hunt such as Sundays.

Gee I wish it were that simply to get pgc to do what we want....the reasonable responsible thing. Just think we could be singing rosenberry and roes praises while skipping in the park instead of having this conversation at all.

ORIGINAL: Dr. Trout

I have posted several times that not just those I know but those talking to the local politcians are totally against Sunday hunting and realize if passed there is not way they can patrol their land on Sundays...

If what is passed, Doc?  HB1760 (that doesn't add one Sunday to any season)?  or Sunday deer hunting?

"Specifics? You saying that if HB1760 passes, they will post immediately not knowing when or if any Sundays are added? "

Cant say for sure. I would guess that if they are against it, it wouldnt sit very well with them to have a squirrel hunter coming through their woods any more than any other type. Just a guess.

Though it is really a moot point. Sunday hunting is all about the deer. And when it is implemented for deer there is no reason for it not to be for everything else if they go that far.

I am against sunday hunting and have given my reasons. If it is passed, I would strongly prefer the bandaid rip approach. Just make it another day and done across the board. This doesnt need to be pgcs little "toy", and we dont need the effects to be "hid" by stretching it out. Slap it on us and adjust accordingly or face even more pressure. Thats exactly how it should be. This also would save us all alot of fighting by having to go through all of this again once the deer issue arises. If given the say, they WILL implement it for deer soon thereafter anyway. For me, that is a pretty much written in stone as I see it.

If what is passed, Doc? HB1760 (that doesn't add one Sunday to any season)? or Sunday deer hunting?

For all intense purposes, its the exact same thing.

ORIGINAL: wayne c

"Specifics? You saying that if HB1760 passes, they will post immediately not knowing when or if any Sundays are added? "

Cant say for sure. I would guess that if they are against it, it wouldnt sit very well with them to have a squirrel hunter coming through their woods any more than any other type. Just a guess.

 
As I have said before, whether one is for this intitiative or not, take the time to explain the details to those that may not have the same understanding of it.  If you hear from a landowner that he will shut his land down, ask why.  If it is based off of misinformation, maybe the land would stay open for those that use it with a better understanding of the process.
 
I hear it all the time. "I talked to this farmer and he will shut his land down".  When I ask specifics, I rarely get a specific answer.  Too much is at stake.

ORIGINAL: wayne c

If what is passed, Doc? HB1760 (that doesn't add one Sunday to any season)? or Sunday deer hunting?

For all intense purposes, its the exact same thing.

So it is acceptable to you for land to be shut down now if it becomes legal for deer to be hunted on Sundays during the 2014/15 season?  Especially if the landowner bases their decision on the wrong information?

I know why I support HB1760 S-10, and it is not Sunday hunting for deer.  People got their reasons for and against.  Hopefully it is not based on misinformation.

On thing is for certain, as hunter numbers decrease along with participation hours of the ones we still have, opportunities will increase for those of us that wish to continue hunting.  It is a national trend that Pa. will not be immune from.

The main reason HB1760 should give control to the PGC to regulate the days to hunt is CHOICE. In this day and age the modern hunter is faced with many obstacles. CHOICE is for the hunter and landowner alike it what it boils down to. CHOICE, you don't like you don't have to participate.

Did the 43 states that allow Sunday hunting cut their own throats ?

ORIGINAL: S-10

All this go slow, start with small game or woodchucks crap tells me is that there a bunch of you folks pushing for Sunday hunting that realize that it will lead to the loss of currently open land and are trying to figure out how to keep the loss as low as possible. You keep it as low as possible by not forcing it down the landowners throat.

There are some that could care less if land is closed.  I am not one of them.  Would it happen? Probably on a small scale when it is all said and done.  Not nearly what some are predicting, IMO. If taking it slow, keeps any of it open, I am all for it. 

And I would vehemently disagree that anything is being forced down anyone's throat.  The issue is not a landowner's rights issue.  They retain every right that had before as a property owner.
 
*Edited to add that not one piece of property I hunt would be affected by either HB1760 or the BOC legalizing Sunday deer hunting. But I appreciate that others may not be as fortunate.

ORIGINAL: wayne c

I know why I support HB1760 S-10, and it is not Sunday hunting for deer. People got their reasons for and against

.

Respectfully dpms, that doesnt carry much weight or soothe many fears with most of us that have those type of concerns, since you arent the one that will be regulating it.

 
I wasn't trying to ease your fears. A false assuption was made about my support of a bill.  I am also well aware it is all about deer for some for and against.

The main reason HB1760 should give control to the PGC to regulate the days to hunt is CHOICE. In this day and age the modern hunter is faced with many obstacles. CHOICE is for the hunter and landowner alike it what it boils down to. CHOICE, you don't like you don't have to participate.

Choice... what a joke... as you have already posted it will not effect your hunting.. but you are one of a few that will not be effected...

there are many that Sunday hunting will effect... fewer tags.. shorter seasons, more posted land...

you should think of hunters in general not just your personal situation...


"misinformation"... just what misinformation are landowners getting... they have clearly stated that want NO MORE SUNDAY HUNTING... what needs to be explained they are not ignorant... they know Sunday hunting will mean more hunters on their land... that is what they do not want... that want that one day to not have to worry about hunters... why is that so hard for you Pro-Sunday guys to understand..

it has NOTHING to do with "misinformation".. the owners I talk to simply want one day they do not have to worry about hunters on their property...

that is simple for me to comprehend... no squirrel hunters.. no ducks hunters, no rabbit hunters, especially no deer hunters === NONE === for at least one day a week..

so where's this misinformation... ???

If the reason to change the law is not to be able to hunt SOMETHING on Sundays what's the reason for wanting a change in the law allowing it ??????????????

The smoke screen about who decides is BULL.... if the PGC went to the congress and showed more of a species need harvested they may get that animal added to the list that is already legal to hunt... or are you guys just forgetting we already have Sunday hunting for some creatures ????????????

That scenario is always never mentioned....

ORIGINAL: Dr. Trout

there are many that Sunday hunting will effect... fewer tags.. shorter seasons, more posted land...

 
Do you have data to back it up from the 43 states with Sunday hunting or are these assumptions?

"misinformation"... just what misinformation are landowners getting... they have clearly stated that want NO MORE SUNDAY HUNTING...

 
You have said multiple times that "if passed" land would be shut down.  Since HB1760 is the only thing that could be passed that is on the table in regards to Sunday hunting, do these folks that you speak of understand that the bill does not add one Sunday to any season?