Stream Ettiquette

That's all fine and dandy...and I'd have to agree with more than I disagree, but I do have to ask- Who died and made that guy the ethics God? If I walk up a stream and suddenly find the Orvis guy sipping tea (or a soy latte) while watching insects flutter on the water, I'm wading out and casting a line. If he's fishing, fine but I don't cater to someone sitting on a bank and waiting....Sorry, Charlie. You can study the water while I'm fishing.  As far as moving half an hour out of the way of another fisherman....that's a joke if I ever heard one anywhere I've ever been in PA. Even on remote sections of Penn's...you're gonna have too many guys to ever find conditions like that. And if on the rare occasion that I did..well that's plenty of water for two people to share without feeling crowded. You want solitude, don't fish in PA.

mike had it posted in a sticky....here it is:
Etiquette- OK boys and girls, time for the nitty gritty on this one. Numerous past posts, several by me, have addressed this topic before, but let's give it another go around. Now, of course the following are merely my own opinions- you may agree or disagree. However, one thing we can all agree upon is that there is an alarming lack of streamside etiquette on the tribs. Here goes...
Elbow room- there's not enough of it at times, and that's a fact. Don't crowd your way into a spot, give your fellow anglers as much room as you can, and never take a guy's spot if he's landing a fish, taking a ****, etc... First come, first serve is the rule. If you think you're too close and there's not enough room to sqeeze into a spot, chances are you're right- move on. There are plenty of spots- if a guy is "hogging" a hole, ask if you can share it- if the answer is yes, great! If it's no, then respect that and move to another spot. ALWAYS make room for children and the disabled- this is non-negotiable. Be polite, help an angler net a fish when need be, get out of there way when they are playing fish, and they will respond in kind. Don't walk through someone's drift, ever. If not sure the proper etiquette or position to stand, watch what others are doing. If you're way out in the middle of a pool, and everyone else is in a similar spot 10 feet behind you, you're out of position. Don't cast over other people's lines. Play fish quickly, and to the maximum that uour equipment can handle- again, if you're not losing the occasional fish, you don't play them hard enough. If 2 guys are super close together, don't assume it's OK for you to stand equally close- chances are they know one another and have a system in place. Again, when in doubt, just ask. Few people will mind a polie request to share water, but remember, just because they say it's OK to fish there, you still need to give them ample room- they were there first. If you fished a run the day before, or in the morning, that does not mean it's "your" spot later that day or the next. If you are having great success, and the guy next to you is not, be neighborly, offer them a hand- everyone on here has benefited from the kindness of strangers at one time or another. Don't litter- EVER. Most of our waters are private, and open due to the generosity of landowners. Pick up trash, whether it is yours or not. Respect landowners, don't do anything in front of their homes that you wouldn't like in your backyard, and be sure to tell them "thanks" when you do see them. Don't trespass. Treat the land with respect- if you need specifics on this, then this might not be your sport- go take up golf. Take your kids, your spouse, your parents or your friends fishing- you'll never regret it. Now, to another touchy subject, "internet" etiquette.
Don't spot burn. If you have, know of, or have found a great, out-of -the way spot, good for you- keep it to yourself. You aren't the only person who knows of this spot (believe me) and by posting it's whereabouts or conditions, you're announcing to the masses to go there. This topic has been dicsussed ad nauseum, so I won't beat a dead horse, but please, use some common sense. Many other sites (and I wish this site would adopt this) do not allow the naming of specific rivers, spots, and accesses. I would like to see posts and reports limited to the following- Elk, Walnut, Mouth of Trout Run, and 20-Mile. All others to be referred to as West-side or East-side tribs. Elk to be discussed as mouth-Rt5, Rt-5 to Rt20, Rt20 to Follies, and Follies and above. If someone says "fished Elk yesterday, between Rt5 and RT20, water was great, caught a lot of fish" well, isn't that enough? He's given you all that you need to know to have a successful day yourself, without getting too specific. Similarly, if I guy posts that he fished a smaller East-side trib, water was great and dropping fast, caught fish all the way to Rt5, well, again, isn't that sufficient? Does it matter if it was 7 Mile or 12 Mile? We have to protect our resource, and that means being smart when posting on this board. Don't whine about not having time to explore, having to drive too far for it not to be good, etc... Like many of you, I drive a decent dsitance to fish, my time is limited, and I want to catch fish. But don't ask to be spoon-fed information, it's annoying, and it lessens your enjoyment in the long-run, as well as does nothing to improve your skills as an angler. Don't post how far up fish have made it. Don't post private property or private access. Too many times, someone will post a specific, oftentimes under-fished spot; you can guarantee that the next day, that spot will see a drastic increase in traffic- it's a given, and is empircal. Resist the urge to brag about a spot, report with pics instead (which we all enjoy seeing them anyway!) and PM people specific questions and answers if you care to do so.

Well, that's about it for now- again, feel free to post your own thoughts on the above, and good luck to all this season. I hope everyone catches plenty of fish, enjoys the camraderie of family, friends and fellow anglers, and that everyone has a safe and productive steelhead season.

Dan

 

ORIGINAL: Screamin Steel

That's all fine and dandy...and I'd have to agree with more than I disagree, but I do have to ask- Who died and made that guy the ethics God? If I walk up a stream and suddenly find the Orvis guy sipping tea (or a soy latte) while watching insects flutter on the water, I'm wading out and casting a line. If he's fishing, fine but I don't cater to someone sitting on a bank and waiting....Sorry, Charlie. You can study the water while I'm fishing.  As far as moving half an hour out of the way of another fisherman....that's a joke if I ever heard one anywhere I've ever been in PA. Even on remote sections of Penn's...you're gonna have too many guys to ever find conditions like that. And if on the rare occasion that I did..well that's plenty of water for two people to share without feeling crowded. You want solitude, don't fish in PA.

 
take it with a grain of salt

ORIGINAL: Screamin Steel

...If I walk up a stream and suddenly find the Orvis guy sipping tea (or a soy latte) while watching insects flutter on the water, I'm wading out and casting a line. If he's fishing, fine but I don't cater to someone sitting on a bank and waiting....Sorry, Charlie. You can study the water while I'm fishing....

one of the more absurd things written on this site in awhile


i would say that the guy you just high-holed would be following ettiquette to skip, throw, and chuck the largest rocks possible at your fly

I just fished on Elk this past weekend and man where they hitting a Black Wolly bugger with a 1.56 inch tail and 3.5 wraps of Chennel and .4 inches of wrap.
YA they were hitting at 8 hours 35 minutes and 34 seconds after the 3rd rain drop hit the water.
That log pile up there by the access you know the one that is 115 steps and 3 slips up stream.
Well it was the 3rd branch that stuck out and 2 feet under the drift where the moonlight hits the water.
Wow! Just caught one right after the other!
I sure hope no one else finds this spot so I can catch them up there like that next time!

Enjoyed the post guys!

My buddies and 7 year old son always have a good time up there after the 3 hour drive but every now and then you run into the wrong fella or crowd!

Keep em screamin!

Heres another:

Respect an Angler's Space
This is probably the most violated rule on the river. Many popular sections of a river can be very crowded during the spawning run. Crowding another angler is inconsiderate. If you approach him or her, make sure to ask before moving into the area. Give the angler enough space so the two of you can fish without interference.

Don't Walk into a Run
Nothing aggrevates a veteran steelheader more than another angler walking into a run of fish. Most of the time it's because the person is not familiar with the stream. Most new steelheader's are not yet accustomed to reading water. A common rule I use is "don't go past your knees". Once again, watch where people are fishing. If you're not sure, ask.

Don't Jump into Another Person's Spot
When an angler is fighting a fish, more than often they may have to move from their spot to land the fish. This doesn't mean the space is available, because more than likely the person is coming back.

Don't Play a Foul Hooked Fish  <-----------Still debating about this one!
If you foul hook (accidentally snag) a steelhead, snap the line. Tackle is cheap. Most foul hooked steelhead are very difficult to control, resulting in injury or unnecessary stress to the fish. Once foul hooked, they will leap from the water and thrash about, spooking the other fish. If you repeatedly fight foul hooked fish in a crowded section, you'll become very unpopular. Also, you will find most game wardens look at this practice unfavorably.

Tolerate Other Forms of Fishing
This is a never ending debate on the local rivers: fly fishermen Vs bait fishermen. To some anglers, fly fishing is the only way to catch steelhead, because they are a trout. I use both fly and spinning gear. One day, I may use minnows - another day I'll drift nymphs. Nothing gets my blood boiling faster than a loudmouth elitist. There is no better or worse style of fishing for steelhead.

Respect People's Property
This has become a major problem on Lake Erie's tributaries. Every year more and more landowners have posted "No Trespassing" signs on their property because they're fed up with garbage left behind and a general lack of respect. If you come upon a posted property don't trespass. If you want to fish there, ask the landowner. If they say "no" respect their wishes. If they allow you, do something nice in return such as cleaning up garbage along the shore.

Don't Litter
Often when I'm fishing I see garbage everywhere. First of all it's pollutes the environment and it's an eyesore. Some sections of streams have been closed to fishing because landowners were fed up with garbage along their property. Make it a habit to pick up discarded monofilament, cans and other trash, and dispose of them properly.

Questioning Anglers that Keep or Release Fish
There is nothing wrong with keeping a fish. Likewise, there is nothing wrong with releasing your catch. If you see an angler release a nice size fish, it is considered rude to say "Aren't you going to keep that?" or "You should keep that one!".

Give Others Space When Fighting A Fish
Give other anglers enough room to land their catch. If it's necessary, take your line out of the water to give them some space. This may happen when you're fishing down river and another angler has to move down river to land a fish.

Walk Quietly Around Others
Be courteous to those already on the streams. Walk behind other anglers and out of the water if possible. If you must stay in the water, walk with minimum surface disturbance.
 
And here was my response to it all:
 
It is an on-going problem all over Mack. And it is certain to continue and even get worse, IMO. I'm a high school teacher, and I have been teaching for nearly 15 years now. I have seen changes evolve in our youth as parents spend more time trying to earn a living and less time with their children. Theres way less focus on discipline and when you give children free time to do what they please, they are certainly not going to make good decisions based upon their upbringing. The only bright spot I foresee for the future, is that less and less youth are getting involved with the outdoors, however thats sad to say. I'd love to see our youth getting more involved, but not when they are ignorant, spoiled little brats. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying they are ALL like that, but more and more are getting to be...and "the good kids" are becioming the minority in our schools....more and more labeling goes on in our public school each year...Learning Support, Emotional Support, Attention Deficit Disorder...blah blah blah! No child left behind baby.....pass 'em through and just get them gradiated to get them out of our hair right? Its not looking good man. What happen to good 'ol fashioned discipline, responsibility and accountability?

Sorry for the rant, but our society is becoming way too sensitive and the dirtbags are taking full advantage of it....this attitude, unfortunately, leaks into every aspect of life....even when it comes to the outdoors, fishing and hunting. All I can do is continue to do my part as a parent and teach my kids right from wrong through good old fashion discipline and respect and hopefully they can continue a dying tradition reflecting our family name positively. At least I can do it at home still (for how long, who knows?) cuz I sure cannot do it in school!

It all boils down to three things...common sense, common respect and common courtesy...three things more and more people of this society demonstrate less of as time goes by....pretty darn sad yet so darn simple!

Thanks, it felt good to get that off my chest...

"It all boils down to three things...common sense, common respect and common courtesy...three things more and more people of this society demonstrate less of as time goes by....pretty darn sad yet so darn simple!" - ShutUpNFish

 
Well said.  Most of the problems I have encountered have been with people who are so self absorbed in what they are doing they show little or no concern for anyone else.  If you are show concern for others around you, ask before you jump into a hole that is crowded, respect the other fisherman's space, etc... things will go well.

ORIGINAL: KJH807

ORIGINAL: Screamin Steel

...If I walk up a stream and suddenly find the Orvis guy sipping tea (or a soy latte) while watching insects flutter on the water, I'm wading out and casting a line. If he's fishing, fine but I don't cater to someone sitting on a bank and waiting....Sorry, Charlie. You can study the water while I'm fishing....

one of the more absurd things written on this site in awhile


i would say that the guy you just high-holed would be following ettiquette to skip, throw, and chuck the largest rocks possible at your fly

 
Well, it obviously got YOUR quilted tweed panties in a bunch, ...and for the record...I'm drowning a big fat nightcrawler and just roped that 6 lb brown that didn't feel like sipping your size 26 bwo, bud.

I always found that keeping focused on the fish and allowing only them drive me rather than the surroundings, people and their attitudes; almost always seems to award me with success.  I've learned that the more I worry about others and **** I cannot control...I catch way less fish. 

you PA yahoos are also carrying guns.....you know us ohioans aren't carrying across the border.....

yes....yes we are...most of us anyway. It's the correct economic demographic for it though....right?

And if ya looked into the laws....you could carry too.


If yur big as The Deetz though.....no need fur heat.

Big boneded

Couldn't help but throw 2 cents in here for the good of the order. It's an etiquette comment but along a different vein. I'll start by saying I rarely fish the tribs but spend as much time as possible on the lake during the summer. I also don't care how many fish anyone (legally) kills. Rope and smoke 'till your hearts content. I had a doctors appt. in Erie late yesterday and couldn't pass up a ride down to the nut to see the lake conditions - WOW! by the way. On my way out of the parking area I pass a guy dragging (literally) three fish from the bridge to the park area on the blacktop. Noticed many people pulling in and out while i was there to catch a glimpse of the lake. I have to believe many of these folks were not fisherman, just wave watchers. While dragging fish down the road is perfectly legal I'd like to question the judgement of doing so in regard to how others might view us as sportsmen/women. I'm the first to want to say I could give a rats****about what anyone else thinks about what i choose to do providing it's legal and within my rights to do so. However like it or not, I also realize that all don't share our views and hold the power at times (via voting, property access, etc.) to dictate our ability to choose what we do. My thoughts are that if I thought it offensive to see someone dragging fish down the road what does the person who doesn't share our views think? Not looking to lecture anyone or start a riot just pointing out that i think as sportsmen we should present ourselves as such and be aware of how we are perceived - it DOES matter!

Who cares?

Depends on whos fart it is...