whats the law?

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kilbasi kid
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2008/11/14 16:37:50 (permalink)

whats the law?

sorry mikeg,first time asking question.I was told to get off someones property,even when I was in the water.I was told as long as I'm in the water,I was not tresspassing on private property.I did not or missed it in the reg book. 
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    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 16:40:07 (permalink)
    No problem and welcome to the forum....

    Yes, it's trespassing even when you are in the water! In PA the property owner does own the water...
     
     
     
    #2
    carcus1211
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 16:47:59 (permalink)
    I don't believe that is entirely correct Mike.  I work at a law firm and I will see if someone can do the research for me.  I will let you guys know.

    LoveGlove United
    #3
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 16:52:55 (permalink)
    Carcus1211,
     
    Thanks for researching it, but to save you a LOT of time....
     
    If the water is NOT considered navigable than tha property owner DOES own the water, gravel, shale, and anything in between.
     
    If the land is posted, stay off...even if you are in the water, you are on THEIR property!
     
     
    #4
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 16:53:29 (permalink)
    BTW....there aren't any creeks in Erie county considered navigable!
    #5
    BucksCOFisher
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 16:54:20 (permalink)
    They don't own the water, just the land underneath and around it. 
    #6
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 16:56:16 (permalink)
    Go float through it in a boat and ask the WCO that's waiting for you at the other end if I'm wrong!
    post edited by mikeg - 2008/11/14 16:59:04
    #7
    NYFISHER
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 16:59:34 (permalink)
    In Pa, if the river or stream is deemed to be a navigable waterway, you can legally be in the stream-bed up to the high water mark.
     
    Little Junita Court Case
    http://troutunderground.com/2008/02/08/donny-beaver-beaten-like-a-junkyard-dog-in-court-spring-ridge-club-cant-close-off-little-juniata/
     
    Lehigh River
    http://www.fish.state.pa.us/anglerboater/2000/00julaug/lehighhh.pdf
    #8
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 17:01:12 (permalink)
    Like a stated before....Navigable.
    Nothing is deemed Navigable in Erie County!
    #9
    kilbasi kid
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 17:02:14 (permalink)
    well jentlemen I'm really confused.I THINK I'LL GO WITH MIKEG.
    #10
    BucksCOFisher
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 17:02:15 (permalink)
    http://www.fish.state.pa.us/water/public/faq_public_waters.htm

     
    It says that you can float on the water, but not fish it.  The land owner does not own the water.
    post edited by BucksCOFisher - 2008/11/14 17:04:08
    #11
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 17:04:12 (permalink)
    Wise choice, my friend!
    There is just too much available water that you can legally fish to even have to worry about it!
     
    Respect the land owners wishes and fish somewhere else if they have it posted!
    #12
    BucksCOFisher
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 17:15:14 (permalink)
    I was never saying to fish posted property.  I myself have never been booted from anyones land.  Why, because if I don't belong there I am not going to go there.  I was just trying to clarify things.
    #13
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 17:17:14 (permalink)
    Ok, considering we are in the Erie Watershed forums, I will assume we are just talking about Erie county so I'll try one more time here...........
     
    In order for you to be able to float through any type of private property it must be deemed navigable by the COURTS..
     
    There aren't ANY streams deemed navigable in Erie County so if you float through on anything you will be considered trespassing! With that being written, the land owner does own the "water" you are in!
    #14
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 17:18:16 (permalink)
    ORIGINAL: anadromous

    Does anyone ever hit the search button...?????????

     
    True, but this is a much better topic than fishing buddy/club drama, isn't it?!
    #15
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 17:25:55 (permalink)
    What waters are considered to be private?
    Private waters are non-navigable rivers, streams and lakes.
    #16
    2Bonthewater
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 17:40:42 (permalink)
    http://forums.fishusa.com/to_Quadvin/m_130513/tm.htm

    had this discussion last week or so.............

    My reply to a poster.......

    WRONG

    Your response on the reports page is WRONG...........property owners own to the middle of the creek--the ground and gravel--streambed  and the air space above........you MAY NOT wade the creek if posted or if you are told you are tresspassing............now, being in a watercraft is a different scenario....navigational servitude---you can float through the property--staying center, but you may not recreate while on or along their property....if you get the craft stuck, you may not get out to WALK the craft over rocks or through shallow water.........

    if the property owner owns both sides of the creek.........then he owns all the gravel and streambed..............not just to the middle of the creek

    a river deemed navigational supercedes all that is written above....where you may walk the stream so long as you stay within' the high water mark of the stream---check little juniata decision
     
    PS.......most WCO's are not going to be waiting to deal with a tresspassing issue, unless it is PFBC property........for the most part....it will be up the local police, state police or whatever entity has jurisdiction in said area
    post edited by 2Bonthewater - 2008/11/14 17:45:20
    #17
    Mr.Slickfish
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 18:51:44 (permalink)
    Posted means posted. On the water, in the woods, or on my porch. Play it safe....Keep out.

    I don't always snag fish, but when I do...
    I choose Little Cleos

    I'm the best looking smartest snagging poacher alive...
    #18
    Deadbolt401
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 18:55:12 (permalink)
    "No body owns the water....It's gods water!"

    Someone nail that quote!!!
    #19
    Split Shot
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 19:19:17 (permalink)
    Mr. Slickfish, I would not go near posted land. but to be technical, you *CAN* float thru it. I would not do it, because I wouldn't want to p**s off the land owner.

    My Wife said, if I go fish'n one more time, she'll leave me! God, I'm going to miss her!
    #20
    Split Shot
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 19:31:24 (permalink)

                                                                                                                                                                          Is it really that big of a deal if a new guy wants to ask a question? You got guy's on here talking about all kinds of nonsense. Every single subject has been posted over the years. If a new guy hit the search button for info every time he had a question, He never would get to post. And how would he get 3,000 post in 2 years like some of the guys here?
    post edited by Split Shot - 2008/11/15 17:11:38

    My Wife said, if I go fish'n one more time, she'll leave me! God, I'm going to miss her!
    #21
    Mr.Slickfish
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 19:34:01 (permalink)
    Split,
    Can I technically duck hunt posted land from a hovercraft if i stop all forward motion? 

    I don't always snag fish, but when I do...
    I choose Little Cleos

    I'm the best looking smartest snagging poacher alive...
    #22
    Split Shot
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/14 19:38:17 (permalink)
    I don't know, but I would like a ride if you have one!

    My Wife said, if I go fish'n one more time, she'll leave me! God, I'm going to miss her!
    #23
    carcus1211
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/15 09:58:41 (permalink)
    thanks Mike.... i do know that if the land owner doesn't own both sides of the property then they only own the the middle of the creek.  and unless you want to really pss ppl off, just walk down the middle of the creek and then you can have both landowners waiting for you...lol....  I only know of 1 location on upper Walnut that is totally posted and they get ****ed... that's above (don't know the road) Old Sterritania.  You'll go under another bridge and the creek will make a 90 to the left with a deep hole at the angle.  There's a house on the left and a little waterfall on the right.  they don't like ppl at all.  I know them and will grant access to move upstream only in the creekbed to those they know.  Took me awhile to get access, but still risky if they are in a bad mood.

    LoveGlove United
    #24
    kilbasi kid
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/15 10:33:47 (permalink)
    sorry guys for stirring up the fishing pool.This was my first time on here asking a question.I usually just keep to myself, read whats happening out their.Alright next time I'll use the search key.I DIDN'T see the sign,apolagized,quickly left.
    #25
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/15 10:46:56 (permalink)
    Hey man, don't apologize....
     
    If everybody just it the search button then there wouldnt be anything to chat about. There isn't a topic that hasnt been talked about here so it would be a pretty boring place if you and others didn't ask questions like this one.
     
    If you don't know, just ask! Besides, it's good to bring stuf up like this every now and than!
    #26
    bigfoot
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/15 11:03:24 (permalink)
    Mike, you are correct. The law is Riparian rights. The Pa fish and boat commission web site has information on the use of waterways.
    #27
    Mr.Slickfish
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/15 11:21:25 (permalink)
    Kid,
    You will get 25 different answers if you ask what color the water is. Only half of them will pertain to actual water color. (guilty of this myself). Most of it is in good fun and good debate. You didn't stir anything up.
    post edited by Mr.Slickfish - 2008/11/15 11:23:53

    I don't always snag fish, but when I do...
    I choose Little Cleos

    I'm the best looking smartest snagging poacher alive...
    #28
    kilbasi kid
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/15 12:08:50 (permalink)
    alright guys next question.If I'm standing on the outside of the posted property,and throw my line into the water of the posted property,am I still trespassing? just kidding. But wait,now thats a good question.I KNOW, STAY AWAY FROM POSTED PROPERTY.Thanks for the answers to my question.
    #29
    mikeg
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    RE: whats the law? 2008/11/15 12:41:34 (permalink)
    Here's a funny one for ya.....
     
    Back in Texas we use to fish the Electric Company's warm water disharge. There was a fence that use to divide the non access area to the public area. BUT...they never had a problem with us casting over the fence to the restricted area. For some reason the redfish would just STACK up on the other side and they would nail a bait as soon as it hit the water. The only problem was getting a 5-10 lb fish over the divided...lol
     
    So if you could manage to get a fish over without your line breaking or fast enough to keep it from the racoons, you could fill a limit pretty quick during the winter months!
    #30
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