Debt ceiling fiasco

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Porktown
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2023/05/25 14:40:31 (permalink)

Debt ceiling fiasco

Hopefully this is avoided and figure something out. The economy is already on life support. Inflation seems to be “in check”, but that just means the ridiculous price hikes are just staying at that level instead of going up any higher. Doubt they will go down. The stock market is pretty much a waste land to burn away any wealth with growth stocks in depression level values. Default on the debt and it will take the rest of the market with it along with a full blown recession that will likely make the “Great Recession” look like peanuts. Probably somehow have inflation take off again too?

That said, I agree with most of what the GOP lawmakers are asking for. At least on face value, I don’t know the exact details. At face value, I can see why many call the Dems socialists and such. Some ridiculous waste. That said, 20% cuts and none for the military is too far. Go after the covid money, add work requirements for food stamps and medicaid and even go after the college debt payback money.  But cutting DHS, IRS, etc by 20% is not the answer. Freezing them at their current levels is still putting them below Trump levels if you factor inflation to what they need to operate.  Find out what Trump levels were, add in adjustment for inflation and that is what it should be.  If GOP disagrees, then show the country the hypocrisy and default would be 100% on them.  None of it is worth the outcome if there is a default. I’m hopeful they can get much of this accomplished without damage. Hold up other stuff as hostage that will effect the other party. Tanking the economy for “a win” is just dumb.
 
The Chip Roy stuff, beyond student loan stuff is ridiculous politics that has no place in this debt ceiling discussions.

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/...licans-are-making.html
post edited by Porktown - 2023/05/25 14:53:19
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    MyWar
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/05/25 15:41:39 (permalink)
    Porktown

    That said, I agree with most of what the GOP lawmakers are asking for. At least on face value, I don’t know the exact details. At face value, I can see why many call the Dems socialists and such. Some ridiculous waste. That said, 20% cuts and none for the military is too far. Go after the covid money, add work requirements for food stamps and medicaid and even go after the college debt payback money. 


    There is no reason for a debate about this. There shouldn’t be any cuts to anything. The legislation is already passed. The funding was in the legislation. This is a decision to pay debt, not fund the spending.

    You really dislike the idea of student loan forgiveness, right? So how is it any different when the government decides that it isn’t going to pay back debt that it already agreed to take on? Seems like a remarkably similar situation to me, except the US government defaulted on debt has much bigger economic ramifications than some random kid out of college.

    Furthermore, a substantial portion of the debt was accrued when Trump was in office, and Republican in congress didn’t care about reckless spending then. But now they suddenly care about debt again because a democrat is in the White House.

    Maybe instead of spending cuts we should roll back the tax cuts that never managed to “pay for themselves” like they were supposed to.

    It’s so utterly predictable and tedious and disengenuous.
    #2
    bigfoot
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/05/25 16:09:27 (permalink)
    I heard it said that getting the debt limit issue settled is like passing a kidney stone: it will hurt for awhile but eventually pass.

    "If someone offers you a breath mint, take it.
     
     
    #3
    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/05/25 16:29:20 (permalink)
    Don't get me wrong, I don't think they should be holding this hostage.  Just as I noted that they should be holding hostage other stuff that is hurting the other party only, not tanking the economy.
     
    I was under the impression they are talking about budget cuts to upcoming budget, not the one that passed under the previous Congress' term.
     
    I am also talking policy when I say that I agree with much of what they are bringing up.  Not how it is being approached.  I don't even know why the Covid funds pulled at this point are even a debatable subject?  The energy thing, I think a compromise to have trade off on both is what compromise in government should be. 
     
    Adding work requirements to able bodied recipients, on paper, sounds like something that I would agree with.  The details, I am not sure of, since I don't know the details.  But face value, this is why the Dems get the socialist tag.  Why would there be pushback on this?  Again, maybe the details in "able bodied" or other is where the issue is?  CNBC isn't exactly the Drudge Report or FoxNews.
     
    I have no idea what you are trying to compare government spending and student debt.  This needs to be college cost reform, not blind student debt forgiveness.  If you want to have programs like the public service debt forgiveness or furthering grants for majors that are in demand or serve the public, 100%.  Blindly paying student debt for a select group of primarily 18-30 year old people, but leaving everyone else out is ridiculous.  Why shouldn't someone that is in debt taking out small business loans or someone that is in debt for other work related items be awarded the same thing?  What is the difference between my mortgage debt and my student loan debt?  With two kids, I have FAR more expenses and mortgage is far more than 99% of single 18-30 somethings college debt.  What makes them different?  Just because their student debt is current and mine is paid off?  I get that college is more expensive now, but it isn't all that far beyond compounded inflation.  It comes down to buying votes, just as many tax policy changes are for the ultrawealthy.  I just happen to call it out on both sides.  
    #4
    EMitch
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/05/25 23:01:51 (permalink)
    They knew the debt ceiling was a problem. The Speaker met with Biden in early February, then the President wouldn't talk to him for 97 days. Biden chose "the my way or the highway" stance, in other words an Iron Headed game of chicken. But then, it's always come down to this over previous debt limit hikes. I think the last actual budget we had was in '99, using continuing resolutions to increase spending. In March, the House passed a bill raising the debt limit by 1.4 trillion, but goes only with some spending cuts. (Strictly partisan).  They want to go back to 2022 levels of spending, and the Democrats want to spend more. (The over spent by 2.5 trillion in '22, so I don't think they've cut enough). Every single Democrat in the House voted against raising the debt ceiling, and as for the Senate, Schumer has presented no plan at all and will not put the House bill on the floor for fear that it would pass, 'cause many of the 'Crats know that we can't keep spending like drunken sailors. If they don't come to an agreement on Friday, Congress will recess for the holiday, and that will push it to the limit. Biden and the 'Crats think McCarthy will fold, but I don't think Biden is gonna get a "clean" debt bill. Since the bill has already passed the House and the Schumer won't advance it for vote in the Senate, (remember he has presented NO plan at all), then if we default, it's his fault. If it would pass in the Senate and Biden vetoes it, then the onus is on him.
    post edited by EMitch - 2023/05/25 23:06:31

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    #5
    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/05/26 07:51:35 (permalink)
    Mitch, I agree with the jist of what you are saying. But the fact of the matter. The budget and debt limit are two separate issues. McCarthy is taking the debt limit issue as hostage for the same “my way or the highway” that you noted Biden doing. The debt limit should not be used. Find something else to take hostage that is an actual Dem issue. Willingness to crash the entire economy to “cut spending” (on Dem favored programs, while not on GOP favored programs), is not the place. If the debt ceiling is raised or they default, it doesn’t change a thing on the budget, besides likely being forced to fund recovery programs for an economic catastrophe that they caused. The debt limit is 100% on McCarthy and the Congress. The budget is a separate issue, which I agree with most of the GOP proposals. At least those outlined in the CNBC article, not knowing the fine details.
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    EMitch
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/05/26 09:02:42 (permalink)
    The 1.8 billion Inflation Recovery Act, (lately called the Climate Change over funding) was not part of the budget. All that money was borrowed and the interest comes under the debt limit. BTW, no matter what happens to the 400 billion student loan executive order, it's going to the Supreme Court eventually because of constitutionality.
     
    The administration sent a letter to Congress that McCarthy's bill would destroy "the administrations "historic" economic recovery". What friggin' planet are they living on? They claim they've created 12 million jobs, when in fact, 9.5 million of them were recalls back to their jobs after the pandemic. They still tout this amid the massive layoffs that have already started; the tech industry being particularly hard hit. Seems everything that comes out of D.C., regardless of party,  contains massive amounts of BS, and ya gotta do a lot of research to try and glean the facts and truth. It is tiresome!

    Never try to argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
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    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/05/26 10:01:39 (permalink)
    EMitch
    The 1.8 billion Inflation Recovery Act, (lately called the Climate Change over funding) was not part of the budget. All that money was borrowed and the interest comes under the debt limit. BTW, no matter what happens to the 400 billion student loan executive order, it's going to the Supreme Court eventually because of constitutionality.

    According to the CNBC article, which I am not taking as gospel, but did not appear to be biased in reporting what McCarthy was asking for in holding the debt limit hostage. These two items were not in what McCarthy was asking for, but what Chip Roy and others want added. McCarthy seems to be asking for upcoming budget cuts.

    Again, NONE of these should be holding up the debt ceiling adjustment. It should all be separate. But, for debating on a fishing site, I don’t think we would be going against the Constitution or any other violation to put on the same discussion.

    Government spending is government spending regardless if budget or not. Trump has smashed the record book of government spending and increasing the deficit by a far margin. Most was not in passed budgets. The pandemic had a lot to do with it, so did wars and other spending. We can’t give a pass for one then call another a wreck less spender. The pandemic didn’t instantly end with Trump. Inflation that followed has everything up, including the cost for highways, bridges, equipment for DHS and other agents. It needs to be a factor. Ukraine and other foreign aid is a factor. Trying to fix the border. Not sure why if the GOP controlled government “fixed it” with Mexico paying already, no? It is all bs that each party shoves down our throats via their talking heads.
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    EMitch
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/05/26 12:33:08 (permalink)
    McCarthy and the Committee have stated numerous times that they will not give a "clean" debt bill to the Whitehouse. There must be spending cuts, which is why they want to go back and spend no more than what was spend in 2022. Since they way over spent last year, assuming the same budget, it is not a cut. It's merely "holding the line".
    If they'd give the Biden Administration a clean bill, you know what they'd get.
    HEADLINE! McCARTHY CAVES! HA, HA! WE WIN. NOW WE CAN SPEND RIGHT UP TO THE LIMIT.  And then McCarthy gets voted out and deficit spending resumes normalcy until the entire economy collapses.

    Never try to argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
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    MyWar
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/01 09:47:06 (permalink)
    I dunno man, looks like another debt ceiling crisis will be averted.

    Who gets the credit here? McCarthy? Biden? Both? Schumer, because it still has to get it through the senate with a filibuster proof majority? All of them?

    I’m not sure that the democrats gave up any major concessions here. This probably isn’t something that a lot of voters will give Biden much credit for, but it’s almost as if the guy who has been in American politics since Carter was in office is rather capable of getting things done.

    I also admit I’ll be somewhat impressed if McCarthy can keep his caucus together after this. If he manages to get this deal through and keep his job at the same time then he might be a better fit for speaker than many imagined him to be.
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    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/01 10:24:24 (permalink)
    I thought it was pretty good compromise on both sides. Some of the items the Dems gave up were kind of ridiculous to “have” in the first place. Like the left over Covid funding, where was this going if no deal?

    McCarthy seems to have one of the worst jobs in America right now. Not sure why anyone would even want that role. Unless it is all charades for the cameras and not as dysfunctional as it appears?
    #11
    MyWar
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/01 11:01:10 (permalink)
    Porktown
    Some of the items the Dems gave up were kind of ridiculous to “have” in the first place. Like the left over Covid funding, where was this going if no deal?



    I’d agree. Same with the pause in student loan payments. It was going to resume anyway. Really the only big D concession was the work requirements.

    I think republicans had more to gain by turning this into a disaster because Biden would almost certainly get blamed for that. “Competent governance” isn’t really on brand for House republicans right now.

    There’s definitely an element of political theatre in what’s happening in the House, but look back when Boehner was speaker. He couldn’t wait to get out of there. And there are way more R nutters in the House now. So yea, I don’t think it’s too far from the truth to say McCarthy has one of those the worst jobs in US politics. And to top it off, you know trump will throw him under the bus the first chance he gets, so I’m not sure there’s gonna be some light at the end of tunnel.
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    EMitch
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/01 11:05:31 (permalink)
    71 Republicans voted against; 45 Democrats also voted against. It'll cruise through the Senate because McConnell's minions will see to it, and the Democrats are safe until January of '25. McCarthy is not safe. He'll come up for recall shortly.

    Never try to argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
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    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/01 11:27:28 (permalink)
    From my understanding, McCarthy got everything that he was looking for, go into this stalemate.  I believe loosening restrictions on oil/gas permits and having the budget at 2022 figures.  Which some may say was high, but two years of ~7.5% compounding inflation makes that a 15% cut of what agencies can actually do with that funding.  I am pretty sure it is in line with the historic ~20% of GDP mark.
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    EMitch
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/02 09:18:12 (permalink)
    The House bill only got back 30 of the 80 billion that hasn't been spent on Covid relief, so that gives the 'Crats 50 billion to blow on vote buying programs. They only got back 10 billion of the 87 billion for 87,000 new IRS agents, so the government continues to grow at an unwarranted pace. They didn't get any of the 400 billion Biden wants for student debt relief, but you know that the student debt relief is going to end up in the hands of the Supreme Court. To me, that's 557 billion dollars that could go back to the treasury which would help to lower inflation. In book keeping terms, debit cash, credit spending, but no. The 'Crats are good 'til January of 2025. I knew it would blow through the Senate with all the Republican RINO's voting for. 
    The 400 BN student debt bill ran as a stand alone bill. It was defeated in both Chambers, with 3 Democrat Senators, (Manchin, Sinema, and Testor) voting against it with all Republicans. Biden will veto, setting up the courts. It's ridiculous that waiters or waitresses, or electricians or laborers have to pay for the advanced degrees of people who'll make 3-4 times the money the others could only dream about.
    post edited by EMitch - 2023/06/02 09:44:02

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    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/02 11:52:19 (permalink)
    Mitch, I’m pretty sure the only funds that would have any impact on inflation are the student loan payments. The covid relief funds unless diverted to something else, which I am sure is being watched isn’t happening any time soon, thus doing nothing to inflation. The IRS funding was to revamp the IRS, which they started doing. The funds are a ten year package. They already spent year one and we’re just going to deal with the shortfall in years 7-8 when the funding would run out. Not having any impact on consumer spending, which is what drives inflation.
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    MyWar
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/02 11:58:01 (permalink)
    EMitch
    The House bill only got back 30 of the 80 billion that hasn't been spent on Covid relief, so that gives the 'Crats 50 billion to blow on vote buying programs. They only got back 10 billion of the 87 billion for 87,000 new IRS agents, so the government continues to grow at an unwarranted pace. They didn't get any of the 400 billion Biden wants for student debt relief, but you know that the student debt relief is going to end up in the hands of the Supreme Court. To me, that's 557 billion dollars that could go back to the treasury which would help to lower inflation. In book keeping terms, debit cash, credit spending, but no. The 'Crats are good 'til January of 2025. I knew it would blow through the Senate with all the Republican RINO's voting for. 
    The 400 BN student debt bill ran as a stand alone bill. It was defeated in both Chambers, with 3 Democrat Senators, (Manchin, Sinema, and Testor) voting against it with all Republicans. Biden will veto, setting up the courts. It's ridiculous that waiters or waitresses, or electricians or laborers have to pay for the advanced degrees of people who'll make 3-4 times the money the others could only dream about.


    At this point do you really believe that Republican voters and Republican lawmakers actually care that much about spending? Like that’s gonna be the thing that turns out voters in 2024?

    Personally, I don’t think anybody actually cares about spending. Republican lawmakers *pretend* to care when a democrat is in the White House, but that’s about it.

    Culture war stuff is what gets voters fired up. It’s all transgender whatever, grooming, CRT, immigration, fighting woke Disney, boycotting woke beer, etc… Republican lawmakers are gonna fight those battles. But a battle about spending that could shut down the government and potentially blow up in their faces? I totally understand why they are not picking that as a bill to die on.
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    JerryS
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/02 17:06:41 (permalink)
    EMitch
    The House bill only got back 30 of the 80 billion that hasn't been spent on Covid relief, so that gives the 'Crats 50 billion to blow on vote buying programs. They only got back 10 billion of the 87 billion for 87,000 new IRS agents, so the government continues to grow at an unwarranted pace. They didn't get any of the 400 billion Biden wants for student debt relief, but you know that the student debt relief is going to end up in the hands of the Supreme Court. To me, that's 557 billion dollars that could go back to the treasury which would help to lower inflation. In book keeping terms, debit cash, credit spending, but no. The 'Crats are good 'til January of 2025. I knew it would blow through the Senate with all the Republican RINO's voting for. 
    The 400 BN student debt bill ran as a stand alone bill. It was defeated in both Chambers, with 3 Democrat Senators, (Manchin, Sinema, and Testor) voting against it with all Republicans. Biden will veto, setting up the courts. It's ridiculous that waiters or waitresses, or electricians or laborers have to pay for the advanced degrees of people who'll make 3-4 times the money the others could only dream about.



    Here is a different spin.  Let's pretend the 87,000 new IRS agents is true.  As Porktown stated, this funding occurs over 10 years.  In these 10 years they expect 52,000 agents to retire. So that leaves an increase of 35,000 IRS agents, which added to the current number of 79,000 agents brings the total to 114,000 agents, which is the same amount as back in the early 1990s.  Doesn't look like unwarranted gov't growth to me.
     
    Various nonpartisan studies show tax evasion revenue losses are between $450 billion to $1 trillion per year.  We could cut the deficit in half if a better-staffed IRS could collect just half of the tax evasion losses.  How can the GOP be concerned about the national debt while also wanting to defund the IRS?
     
    It's ridiculous that waiters or waitresses, or electricians or laborers have to pay for the tax cheats who'll make 10+ times the money.
    post edited by JerryS - 2023/06/02 17:11:09
    #18
    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/02 22:33:05 (permalink)
    JerryS
    It's ridiculous that waiters or waitresses, or electricians or laborers have to pay for the tax cheats who'll make 10+ times the money.

    You could say 100+ times and be accurate.
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    DeadGator401
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/03 02:00:58 (permalink)
    JerryS
    EMitch
    The House bill only got back 30 of the 80 billion that hasn't been spent on Covid relief, so that gives the 'Crats 50 billion to blow on vote buying programs. They only got back 10 billion of the 87 billion for 87,000 new IRS agents, so the government continues to grow at an unwarranted pace. They didn't get any of the 400 billion Biden wants for student debt relief, but you know that the student debt relief is going to end up in the hands of the Supreme Court. To me, that's 557 billion dollars that could go back to the treasury which would help to lower inflation. In book keeping terms, debit cash, credit spending, but no. The 'Crats are good 'til January of 2025. I knew it would blow through the Senate with all the Republican RINO's voting for. 
    The 400 BN student debt bill ran as a stand alone bill. It was defeated in both Chambers, with 3 Democrat Senators, (Manchin, Sinema, and Testor) voting against it with all Republicans. Biden will veto, setting up the courts. It's ridiculous that waiters or waitresses, or electricians or laborers have to pay for the advanced degrees of people who'll make 3-4 times the money the others could only dream about.



    Here is a different spin.  Let's pretend the 87,000 new IRS agents is true.  As Porktown stated, this funding occurs over 10 years.  In these 10 years they expect 52,000 agents to retire. So that leaves an increase of 35,000 IRS agents, which added to the current number of 79,000 agents brings the total to 114,000 agents, which is the same amount as back in the early 1990s.  Doesn't look like unwarranted gov't growth to me.
     
    Various nonpartisan studies show tax evasion revenue losses are between $450 billion to $1 trillion per year.  We could cut the deficit in half if a better-staffed IRS could collect just half of the tax evasion losses.  How can the GOP be concerned about the national debt while also wanting to defund the IRS?
     
    It's ridiculous that waiters or waitresses, or electricians or laborers have to pay for the tax cheats who'll make 10+ times the money.


    Jerry get out of here with this logic and realistic information. Ain't nobody got time fo dat!
    #20
    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/03 16:35:25 (permalink)
    I applaud those calling out the GOP to protect the ultra wealthy by noting the actual details of the IRS funding. Ie buying votes and more importantly, buying fundraiser contributions by this group of politicians.

    https://apnews.com/articl...c1ebbe1551f95524cf3ce1

    Can anyone explain why such an objection to work requirements for able bodied recipients of SS/medicaid? Ie buying votes by this other group of politicians, no?
    #21
    EMitch
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/03 21:09:04 (permalink)
    The folks on Wall Street are solidly behind Democrats. I know that Hillary vilified WS, but the truth of the matter is that WS is a cash cow for the DNC and it was for her. Hard to figure when the 'Crats always want tax increases and they have no plan for growth, thinking that 1 1/2% to 2% growth on GDP is the new norm. OTOH, Congress passed work requirements under Bill Clinton and it worked, reducing welfare and getting folks back into the work force. No excuse for Biden being against work requirements except that the Party has veered so far left and the left is dictating what the Party can do? Thought AOC was gonna have a cow.
    As far as the cuts, (over 10 years), Obama agreed to 1.2 billion in 2012, so why the big fuss over 1.4 billion over time?
     

    Never try to argue with an idiot. They'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.
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    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/04 21:44:03 (permalink)
    EMitch
    The folks on Wall Street are solidly behind Democrats.
     

    Mitch, you seriously are one of my favorite dudes, but honestly couldn’t read past this… I did, but I know you are a wise dude that has to think about this a bit more overall. Look back at history. What happens when the Dem morons get in office? They talk raising taxes on the most wealthy(ie those that control Wall St) and it tanks. If elections were all about Wall Street, I would never even consider Dems. You can almost set your watch to; Dem Pres win and the market tanking. Don’t get me wrong, I am sold on politic being a charade, with most Dems being just fine with corporate greed if they can have a cut. Pretend they are “trying” to change things. So, maybe solidly behind, but in some backdoor (no lube) way? Possibly.
    #23
    JerryS
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/05 10:01:07 (permalink)
    Porktown
    EMitch
    The folks on Wall Street are solidly behind Democrats.
     

    Mitch, you seriously are one of my favorite dudes, but honestly couldn’t read past this… I did, but I know you are a wise dude that has to think about this a bit more overall. Look back at history. What happens when the Dem morons get in office? They talk raising taxes on the most wealthy(ie those that control Wall St) and it tanks. If elections were all about Wall Street, I would never even consider Dems. You can almost set your watch to; Dem Pres win and the market tanking. Don’t get me wrong, I am sold on politic being a charade, with most Dems being just fine with corporate greed if they can have a cut. Pretend they are “trying” to change things. So, maybe solidly behind, but in some backdoor (no lube) way? Possibly.



    Since WWII, the best stock markets have occurred during Clinton, Obama, and Trump respectively, so the current president may not be a big factor.  A bigger factor may be when gridlock exists.
     
    I don't think there is an easy answer to your question about work requirements.  Studies do show that most recipients of the financial aid, that are able to work, are already working.  I think the democrats are worried that many of the people not able to work, and would be exempt from work requirements, would lose benefits due to the bureaucratic red tape involved with applying for exemptions.   Probably one of the reasons the GOP is pushing it.  
     
    Makes you wonder why the republicans are pushing it so strong, when their rural base has a large percentage of the "welfare" population and they may be more likely to fall thru the red tape.
    #24
    Porktown
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    Re: Debt ceiling fiasco 2023/06/05 10:43:23 (permalink)
    Good stuff Jerry.  I stand corrected on the overall Wall St. performance.  Although, looking at history, most Dems inherit a booming stock market and quickly falls as soon as they are in office.  I personally blame that on the top 1% throwing a temper tantrum.  But usually rebounds, since they aren't willing to burn things down and potentially lose money themselves.  Opposite of GOP, it booms early, then falls.  Again, I feel propped up by the 1% as a celebration, but they can only cause temporary moves in the market.  Eventually, earnings, growth, cash on hand and other real indicators of a successful business take over.  The market is more about stability than anything.  Things like the pandemic, wars and other things that cause major uncertainty in supply chains and other, which businesses have issues planning for.  When things are stable, regardless of what side's policies, businesses are able to adjust and profit.
     
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/sergeiklebnikov/2020/07/23/historical-stock-market-returns-under-every-us-president/?sh=4adbcec0faaf
     
    To me on the work requirements, it is mostly part of the political charades.  Each side has their rallying cries.  But do they really want to achieve these "goals"?  GOP claims to want an end to those "sucking off the teet" and border security to name a few.  Dems claim they want the top 1% to pay their fair share.  Yet any time there is a full house and Presidency of that party, they don't do squat to address these rallying cries, beyond some tiny bandage and "we tried"...  Then focus efforts on some BS other issue that maybe 10% of Americans really care about, but is sensationalized in the media both left, right and center, for "all of us to voice an opinion".  i.e. Transgender issues...  If you are correct of worried that it is hitting those that really can't work, then it needs to be made public.  I have yet to hear anyone from the right complain about media bias in this country.    I'd think if this really was the case, it would be reported that way, by at least the center left outlets like CNN, no?  I don't think any center outlets like AP or Reuters is reporting it this way, so I tend to believe it is not really the case.  Maybe I missed those reports that it was though.
    #25
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