draketrutta 
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Scrambled Eggs
just curious as to your thoughts on a #...
just a number, no commentary, no history, no weather effects, etc.......
Q: What percentage of fertilized fish eggs deposited into the gravel stream bed of the SR get trampled like grapes in the wine-making process?
I'll take 80% Alex.
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retired guy
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 10:34:37
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HUGE- but then its a put and take place with guys running all over- does not seem to be a big thing to me. The upper areas where there is NO FISHING have huge natural spawn-walk up there in season and the beds are awesome. Even with all that disturbance a Biologist told me that over half the Hos are natural so its happening despite the river walking. I like late season when most guys are gone- have some places all to myself where crowds once stood up river. The 'late Sharks' are there and spawning pretty much unmolested. Lets face it- those fish are probably enough in an of themselves to produce a huge return number. Even in Steel spawning season there are few river walkers to disturb most beds. Therefore I think it depends on the species of fish being talked about- Steel 80% Sharks 50% Hos- 75% clueless on Browns, Skam and atlantics After that those 'other factors' take over.
post edited by retired guy - 2011/08/08 10:39:34
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hot tuna
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 11:11:07
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strange question..
I have no f'in clue so I'll say
85.925 % salmon
80.225 % brown
69.699 % steelhead
I'm sure our historian will have a better answer..
"whats that smell like fish oh baby" .. J. Kaukonen
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 11:17:07
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ORIGINAL: hot tuna
I have no f'in clue so I'll say
how's that for an answer  seriously, how the eff can one figure that???? i would guess at much less percentages than most said based on most spawning areas i've seen are not crossing areas; but really; how can one even guess...
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Lacrosse Ref
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 11:18:45
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draketrutta
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 11:20:58
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ORIGINAL: dimebrite
ORIGINAL: hot tuna
I have no f'in clue so I'll say
how's that for an answer
psssst.. that would make a great sig line. 
post edited by draketrutta - 2011/08/08 11:21:34
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draketrutta
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 11:22:30
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ORIGINAL: dimebrite
most spawning areas i've seen are not crossing areas; whatcha talkin bout Willis?
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 11:37:57
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ORIGINAL: draketrutta
ORIGINAL: dimebrite
most spawning areas i've seen are not crossing areas;
whatcha talkin bout Willis?
ive found during spawning times there are usually higher waters and MOST fish are spawning in non crossable waters... most natural spawning kings are in late october-november and december; browns are mid november to mid january; skamanias are late february in to march; and regular steels are march to mid may; sorry for the additional info that you STRESSED not to hear about...BBBBBBWWWWWAAAAAAHHHHHHHH
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draketrutta
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 11:58:47
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ORIGINAL: dimebrite
ive found during spawning times there are usually higher waters and MOST fish are spawning in non crossable waters... most natural spawning kings are in late october-november and december; browns are mid november to mid january; skamanias are late february in to march; and regular steels are march to mid may; sorry for the additional info that you STRESSED not to hear about...BBBBBBWWWWWAAAAAAHHHHHHHH
SOP on this forum is to blow up every thread with non-related dribble,,, IMO, that's the charm of this place *********** you fail to consider that there is no gravel in spots like the bottom of the Sportsman's Hole (truly uncrossable) when the water does drop - which it does. The gravel is in the shallower spots - and besides, the eggs don't have to be in a "crossing zone" to get trampled... I'll stay with 80% as my WAG.
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hot tuna
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 12:01:22
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HUH ?? most spawning is / are on gravel shallow bars.. easiest areas to cross .. pre spawn staging areas are below the bars in the deeper waters.. so whatcha ya talkin bout ?
"whats that smell like fish oh baby" .. J. Kaukonen
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 12:12:14
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ORIGINAL: dimebrite
ORIGINAL: draketrutta
ORIGINAL: dimebrite
most spawning areas i've seen are not crossing areas;
whatcha talkin bout Willis?
ive found during spawning times there are usually higher waters and MOST fish are spawning in non crossable waters... most natural spawning kings are in late october-november and december; browns are mid november to mid january; skamanias are late february in to march; and regular steels are march to mid may; sorry for the additional info that you STRESSED not to hear about...BBBBBBWWWWWAAAAAAHHHHHHHH
knock a pro slick; datz whatz i beez talkins bouts; now listen, you better not be takin my greez and draggin it tru da garden now; ya dig?????  honestly; ive seen plenty of spawning fish in waters that are uncrossable... thats it...
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 12:17:08
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and while we're at it; the only places i've seen MORE kings spawning than just above the estuary and in the lower DSR in november and december is the UPPPER; and i mean UPPER RIVA
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 12:23:08
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hot tuna
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 12:36:50
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through the studies by Cornell & sea grant there was a map of the river showing the highest spawning areas.. I believe the area around the glass was tops.. DSR being lowest.. as for ellis, that area can be and is crossed at 1,000.. I'm talking the spawning gravel not the big bend.. No doubt many fish spawn in deeper spots that are un crossable but the majority, shallow gravel bars
"whats that smell like fish oh baby" .. J. Kaukonen
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 12:47:12
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Guys this does get really fun sometimes I must say.... if you haven't noticed yet I tend to lean towards the non text book conditions. Its this notion that keeps me coming back to the river...tight lines.... Ps... I've walked up on herds of kings in higher water in the channels below the meadow when there was snow on the ground; and I've also floated over ellis in late may to see steel spawning in the deeper gravel beds so in reality the text book studies don't sway me too much.... In an attempt to hijack; (who ami kidding I've already hijacked it) I am really looking forward to our official/unofficial gathering. Im gonna be up this weekend to string some roof rafters.... will I be posting a pic of a dimebright RIVER king; let's just wait and see let's see how much the pot gets stirred up now
post edited by dimebrite - 2011/08/08 12:48:21
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draketrutta
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 12:57:32
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that's why I asked for a single WAG #,
do you have one in mind...
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 13:00:23
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ORIGINAL: hot tuna
strange question..
I have no f'in clue...
But for your sake drake;I will say there is probably a very high return rate for the eggs dropped in lower dsr.....bwaaaaaahhhhhh
post edited by dimebrite - 2011/08/08 13:02:12
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retired guy
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 13:04:51
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Just read all the Study info-neat stuff but several years old now. Think that in that time frame the Hos have increased tremendously. It does identify the far upper areas as prime nesting sites and in that regard there are some really great indicators for the natural spawn that is not really covered much in that study in regard to percentage of gross returns. The POTENTIAL is there but no numbers that can be readily stated. Makes me think that the 'tipping' point may have occured in the fishes favor with the minimum release standards having a positive impact on the young fish migrating back to the lake in the spring and early summer. Sometimes in the old hydorelectric days the place was darned near dry on occasion. Had to be killing off youngsters and with a 3 year return on Sharks it can take a few cycles to see the difference in a clear manner. IMHO THATS why the Hos are doing so well they have built up over time and as the Biologist said 57% natural return. GOOD.Could easily be why the Steel numbers are doing so much better in the past few years too. Remember the actual stocking of some species was SIGNIFICANTLY reduced a number of years ago according to the study and now our fish numbers seem close to the old days with the NEW arrivals coming on strong tooo- NATURAL and FLOW are IMHO the keys.
post edited by retired guy - 2011/08/08 13:08:31
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 13:17:53
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ORIGINAL: retired guy
   Just read all the Study info-neat stuff but several years old now. Think that in that time frame the Hos have increased tremendously.
 It does identify the far upper areas as prime nesting sites and in that regard there are some really great indicators for the natural spawn that is not really covered much in that study. The POTENTIAL is there but no numbers that can be readily stated.
 Makes me think that the 'tipping' point may have occured in the fishes favor with the minimum release standards having a positive impact on the young fish migrating back to the lake in the spring and early    summer.             Â
   Sometimes in the old hydorelectric days the place was darned near dry on occasion. Had to be killing off youngsters and with a 3 year return on Sharks it can take a few cycles to see the difference in a clear manner.
IMHO THATS why the Hos are doing so well they have built up over time and as the Biologist said 57% natural return. GOOD.
Hey rt those hoes are crazy. I stumbled upon a spawning pair of hoes this past march in a no name trickle I frequent often (with no rod in hand). Im convinced that MOST fish that frequent this trickle are wild spawners as they have characteristics and features that seem to make me think that. Maybe I should conduct my own study and start tagging the steel that frequent it... maybe i'll disprove tuna's lost soul theory FYI; the area below this inlet of this creek loads up with steel in pre spawn season until the water comes up. Why would they hold there if they didn't have complete intentions to spawn there. Also; one time in mid april I witnessed a young boy catch a baby rainbow there. Btw; this is not the creek some of you might be thinking of and I will not give the location to ANYONE... its too special to have spoiled... But what do I know anyways; I don't read the text books; shame on me.....
post edited by dimebrite - 2011/08/08 13:21:08
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retired guy
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 13:57:00
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Dime-
Even if they arent returning HOME to spawn there the very fact that they do so consistently when the water levels are good enough speaks to the NATURAL thing going on very well.
Again I really believe it has HUGE things to do with the minimum levels on the SR sustaining those young fish up till early Summer for the lake return thing. Easy to imagine how many used to die off when the water went to a trickle for a few days here and there not so many years back.
Am a big believer in the 'tipping point' thing where it can take years for the numbers to get to the point of a few decent nesting cycles and then BANG.
Also think I know where Pucker is but wont tell.
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hot tuna
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 14:13:57
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quite sure I know and steelhead frequent there.
as for the lost soul theory.. when a fish moves in during HIGH water then it receeds only to die from lack of oxygen or it's smolts cook from water temps.. well I give up..
enough of the ego playin.. I'll just sit back and let pro's take over..
At least I'll enjoy the ride.. ride,ride,ride.. at least I'll enjoy the Ride...
"whats that smell like fish oh baby" .. J. Kaukonen
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 14:50:13
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Tuna; we all know you're the only pro around here bottom line; we all see things differently and there is no text book condition.... that's why views and opinions differ. As for my no name creek; I've witnessed steel recede back to the river healthfully; I've seen beds hatch; the fish that frequent it hold just below the mouth until the water comes up; and as I said a little boy caught a juvenille rainbow in it in front of my own eyes... there are too many pieces of the puzzle that fit together in this scenario. And for the record; I would almost guarantee you're thinking of a different no name creek than the one im talking about. Btw; pretty sure thats its spring fed; but am 100% sure it is completely shaded prime makings for a wild stock
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 14:51:37
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salmotrutta
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 14:58:22
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Pure comedy gold. Salmon spawn in da riva rocks? Man, am I stupid.
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 15:01:12
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ORIGINAL: salmotrutta
Pure comedy gold. Salmon spawn in da riva rocks? Man, am I stupid.Â
I've encountered a few that foundme so attractive that they spawned all over me
post edited by dimebrite - 2011/08/08 15:02:18
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salmotrutta
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 18:16:09
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retired guy
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 18:43:37
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Hey-- remember when Drake said -no commentary - just numbers
Guess the hijack is complete.
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 19:17:49
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ORIGINAL: retired guy
Hey-- remember when Drake said -no commentary - just numbers
Guess the hijack is complete.
I am in all honestly laughing out loud
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waDerboy
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 20:29:14
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dimebrite
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RE: Scrambled Eggs
2011/08/08 20:34:54
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ORIGINAL: waDerboy
64.7
Now now wade; id say more like 64.69999 
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