Dr. Trout
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/27 22:22:54
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Wildlife should be managed by wildlife professionals, not politicians. So okay --- you posted a couple examples of rules by politicians in other states I could care less about other states.. I live and hunt in Pa... where's all this "regulating" that Pa politicians are doing??? the one day too many is crap.. It's a law that has been on the books for years.... and they simply are following it .. they are not trying to do anything with it in the way of more regulating.... but have listened to recommendations from the PGC and allowed some species to be hunted.. They aren't regulating anything by themselves.. they respond to input from the PGC... BUT === I"ll wait for your list of things the politicians have regulated on their own.. which I would agree is not a good thing .. but it isn't happening in Pa to my knowledge, but again -- I'll wait for you to correct me on that with the regulating they are doing on their own...
post edited by Dr. Trout - 2011/05/27 22:33:11
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dpms
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/27 22:23:23
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Good talk guys. Points all taken from this guy anyway. Till tomorrow..
post edited by dpms - 2011/05/27 22:25:12
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Dr. Trout
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/27 22:33:52
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same here == good night !!!
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S-10
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 07:10:28
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The issue of regulatory control has not been a issue for the last decade. The BOC majority has not been in favor of Sunday hunting for the last decade. The current BOC majority has now indicated they will support Sunday hunting if given the opportunity. The issue of regulatory control is now a hot button topic. Tell me again the issue of regulatory control has nothing to do with Sunday hunting.  1. The number one reason given for people quitting hunting in Pennsylvania is lack of game. 2. The number two reason given for people quitting hunting in Pennsylvania is lack of places to hunt. Explain how allowing Sunday hunting is going to improve either of these two issues.
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dpms
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 08:18:07
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ORIGINAL: S-10
Tell me again the issue of regulatory control has nothing to do with Sunday hunting.
1. The number one reason given for people quitting hunting in Pennsylvania is lack of game.
2. The number two reason given for people quitting hunting in Pennsylvania is lack of places to hunt.
Explain how allowing Sunday hunting is going to improve either of these two issues.
Probably won't and that is not my concern at the moment. My opinion is that we as hunters should want politicians regulating hunting as little as possible here and across the country. This is an opportunity to strengthen our position now and into the future and remove politics from game management. Our game agency is unable to harvest or protect a species 52 days of the year. That is almost 2 months that the PGC has no say. It is my belief that any negative consequences will be minimal and no different or more detrimental than any past changes. Pa. and our hunters are ones steeped in tradition. That is tough to overcome but we have to as the demographics and beliefs of people are changing with time.
post edited by dpms - 2011/05/28 08:51:16
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Dr. Trout
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 10:29:47
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My opinion is that we as hunters should want politicians regulating hunting as little as possible here and across the country. This is an opportunity to strengthen our position now and into the future and remove politics from game management. #1... as RSB stated I do not think this would strengthen our position, it would be another move to divide the Pa hunters into smaller groups .. our 8% may not grow but it would be divided and division does not strenghen it weakens a position or group... we need to strentghen (add to)our membership and positions not split them up even more... Again I ask for example of the legislature regulating Hunting.. you keep saying that but I see no examples of them making any decisions with out the PGC... remember it's the legislature that has been given the task of making laws.. not the PGC... surely you do not want the PGC making their laws... If they get that power do you also agree that the State police should then be given the power to make their own laws to "regulate" and manage the state's safety ??? Politics will always be involved in game management here in Pa, unlike other states you have to remember the PGC is a separate organization. I do not think the PGC can (on their own) make an entry into the game code (law) for example. When you look at what the PGC (BOC) can do on their own the list is not very long and I concur with the way it is.. The PGC should not make laws on their own... season limits, weapons, no problem with those type decisions What the fines are, private property laws, safety laws, methods, etc etc should not be their decisions alone... Our game agency is unable to harvest or protect a species 52 days of the year How do you figure that ??? The WCOs I know do enforce laws on a Sunday and get calls 24/7 many times... so yes they do protect our wildlife 24/7 everyday of the year... as for protecting... The PGC wanted to "protect" young bucks and allow many to live another year.. thus we got ARs... Is that not "regulating" and protecting wildlife ???? I think they are doing EXACTLY that right now, sure there are folks who think they are not doing that right, but I do not see anyone saying they are not "the ones running the show" If they felt a certain species needed more harvest I am sure the BOC could and would try to "regulate" that and with PGC staff support request the legislature to add that species to the list allowed for Sunday hunting. In fact the BOC is making changes without the support of all the PGC staff now .. isn't that called the BOC regulating ?????? SO ... IF that were to ask for deer to be added.. why would you say the legislature "regulated" the decision..if it were added ??? It was the PGC wanting the change and the legislature approved it and changing a law as require by our constitution.. ?? again I ask for the list of things that the PGC has asked for to manage our states wildlife that the legislature did not give them that you consider "regulating" game management by the "politicians" ... I'll sit back and wait for those.... That is tough to overcome but we have to as the demographics and beliefs of people are changing with time. And MANY MANY MANY people I talk to each day feel these changes are going it the "wrong direction", they are destroying tradition and values.. two things Pa was founded on...
post edited by Dr. Trout - 2011/05/28 10:45:53
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Dr. Trout
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 10:36:05
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The current BOC majority has now indicated they will support Sunday hunting if given the opportunity. S-10.. To my knowledge and information that just is NOT TRUE.. and I am sure dpms will agree.. the MAJORITY of the current BOC is not in favor of Sunday Hunting....
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S-10
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 12:53:12
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We must be gettin our information from a different source because I am hearing it would pass and DPMS has previously indicated he has the same information as I do. I have had more than one correspondence and discussion with my own BOC member and he is also in full favor of it. It's the reason who has control is the hot issue according to my information. It wouldn't be an 8-0 vote but it would pass. They may start slow to let the farm bureau and a few others calm down before implementing it for all game.
post edited by S-10 - 2011/05/28 14:36:45
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 15:14:36
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http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/outdoors/s_722643.html A 2005 study showed that allowing Sunday hunting in Pennsylvania would generate $629 million in economic impact, $18 million in state sales tax and support 5,300 new full- and part-time jobs Gergely said the Democratic leadership in the House plans to push the issue by updating its economic impact figures and holding a hearing sometime this year. He's urged the organizations in the Sunday Hunting Coalition to become a presence at the state Capitol to lobby their case in person, too
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spoonchucker
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 16:38:23
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"Gergely said the Democratic leadership in the House plans to push the issue by updating its economic impact figures and holding a hearing sometime this year." CAN'T be. We all know Democrats are all anti-gun, and anti-hunting 
Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference. Step Up, or Step Aside The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody. GL
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dpms
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 17:10:54
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ORIGINAL: S-10
It wouldn't be an 8-0 vote but it would pass.
Last I heard, maybe 5-3 in favor of a resolution supporting legislation transferring regulatory control of Sunday hunting to the PGC.
My rifle is a black rifle
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dpms
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 17:14:49
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Doc. I made this post earlier in this thread. It addresses what you are asking me.
"We are fortunate here in Pa. as hunters and hunting have rather strong support. Demographics and beliefs are changing across this country. Pennsylvania will not be immune to this forever. There are new avenues of attack from the antis that are taking advantage of these shifts. Much more successfully than in the past.
I choose to not live in the present but to position myself and attempt to position hunters and our sport where we are stronger and better able to defend against threats. Wildlife should be managed by wildlife professionals, not politicians. Mountian lions are overpopulated and elk are scheduled for extermination in California. Bear season on and off in Jersey. These just a few examples of poor decisions being made by folks that have no abilities to make them.
Politicians controlling hunting one day of the year is one day too many, IMO, anywhere where game exists."
My rifle is a black rifle
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bingsbaits
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 17:16:03
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ORIGINAL: Dr. Trout
My opinion is that we as hunters should want politicians regulating hunting as little as possible here and across the country. This is an opportunity to strengthen our position now and into the future and remove politics from game management.
#1... as RSB stated I do not think this would strengthen our position, it would be another move to divide the Pa hunters into smaller groups .. our 8% may not grow but it would be divided and division does not strenghen it weakens a position or group... we need to strentghen (add to)our membership and positions not split them up even more...
Again I ask for example of the legislature regulating Hunting.. you keep saying that but I see no examples of them making any decisions with out the PGC...
remember it's the legislature that has been given the task of making laws.. not the PGC...
surely you do not want the PGC making their laws...
If they get that power do you also agree that the State police should then be given the power to make their own laws to "regulate" and manage the state's safety ???
Politics will always be involved in game management here in Pa, unlike other states you have to remember the PGC is a separate organization. I do not think the PGC can (on their own) make an entry into the game code (law) for example. When you look at what the PGC (BOC) can do on their own the list is not very long and I concur with the way it is.. The PGC should not make laws on their own... season limits, weapons, no problem with those type decisions
What the fines are, private property laws, safety laws, methods, etc etc should not be their decisions alone...
Our game agency is unable to harvest or protect a species 52 days of the year
How do you figure that ???
The WCOs I know do enforce laws on a Sunday and get calls 24/7 many times... so yes they do protect our wildlife 24/7 everyday of the year...
as for protecting... The PGC wanted to "protect" young bucks and allow many to live another year.. thus we got ARs... Is that not "regulating" and protecting wildlife ????
I think they are doing EXACTLY that right now, sure there are folks who think they are not doing that right, but I do not see anyone saying they are not "the ones running the show"
If they felt a certain species needed more harvest I am sure the BOC could and would try to "regulate" that and with PGC staff support request the legislature to add that species to the list allowed for Sunday hunting. In fact the BOC is making changes without the support of all the PGC staff now .. isn't that called the BOC regulating ??????
SO ... IF that were to ask for deer to be added.. why would you say the legislature "regulated" the decision..if it were added ???
It was the PGC wanting the change and the legislature approved it and changing a law as require by our constitution.. ??
again I ask for the list of things that the PGC has asked for to manage our states wildlife that the legislature did not give them that you consider "regulating" game management by the "politicians" ...
I'll sit back and wait for those....
That is tough to overcome but we have to as the demographics and beliefs of people are changing with time.
And MANY MANY MANY people I talk to each day feel these changes are going it the "wrong direction", they are destroying tradition and values.. two things Pa was founded on...
But yet you were all for dividing the hunters to get your crossbow. You even said you would join the anti-PGC folks if you did not get it....
"There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
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S-10
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 17:59:34
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Last I heard, maybe 5-3 in favor of a resolution supporting legislation transferring regulatory control of Sunday hunting to the PGC.
_____________________________
My rifle is a black rifle That's my understanding of the numbers also. In order to get 5 votes, once they have control they will not make it all game everywhere on Sunday in the beginning.
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S-10
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 18:01:46
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S-10
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 18:04:37
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CAN'T be. We all know Democrats are all anti-gun, and anti-hunting Your right, now I really smell a rat in the woodpile. Must be they realize it will hurt the hunters in the long run. 
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spoonchucker
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 18:27:19
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Yup! Before you know it the Republicans will be handing out vouchers for free abortions, as a way of ending them.
Conspiracies are so much fun. You can say/believe anything you want, and it doesn't even have to make sense.
Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference. Step Up, or Step Aside The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody. GL
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S-10
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 18:57:12
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bingsbaits
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 19:22:37
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You know what is really hilarious about this whole issue, You all make it sound like the world of hunting is going to come to an end for "ONE DAY". Let's say they (the PGC) does get control of the game management(as it should be) and they decide to add that Sunday during the two week season. Still a Monday start and a Saturday end, "ONE DAY" yes let me repeat that "ONE DAY". You all make it sound like they are going to exstend deer season for every Sunday of the year.HAHAHAH...."one DAY" Folks can't feel safe, all the shooting, horse back riders and hikers have to stay indoors, all over "ONE DAY".. Would like to see how many of the whiners actually have even gone into the woods on that Sunday in deer season.... Some people need to grow up and quit being so dam selfish.... Did I mention it is "ONE DAY"
post edited by bingsbaits - 2011/05/28 19:23:10
"There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
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bingsbaits
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 19:28:19
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And I don't want to hear about Archery it is the guns and all the shooting on Sunday that you say will close all the lands to public hunting....
"ONE DAY""
"There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
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dpms
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 20:32:52
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ORIGINAL: S-10
That's my understanding of the numbers also. In order to get 5 votes, once they have control they will not make it all game everywhere on Sunday in the beginning.
My take as well. I suspect that if the PGC gets control(probably a pipe dream) maybe we will see youth turkey, bear and possibly some small game. Appreciate the fact that you can differentiate between the two issues here.
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dpms
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 20:36:25
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ORIGINAL: bingsbaits
"ONE DAY""
That is funny, Bings. The worst case scenario for anti Sunday hunting folks is Sunday hunting for deer. All the land being closed, the deer herd destroyed and non-hunters being up in arms all for "one day". I don't even think deer will be on the radar if anything changes as far as a transfer of regulatory control. But if deer were on the radar, worst case is one day.
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bingsbaits
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 20:49:42
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As a selfemployed person I should be dead set against it. I can hunt when I please and this extra day would put more prssure on the game I like to chase. There by making it a little harder for me. But "DOC" got it through my thick skull during the crossbow debate that we should not try to deny others hunting opportunities(be it weapon or days to hunt) for our own personal reasons. Just think Doc down the road some day you may have 5 extra days to use that new crossbow. We should all be united as hunters and try to provide the best hunting experience for"ALL".
"There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
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S-10
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 20:57:48
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Dr. Trout
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 21:03:33
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Gergely said the Democratic leadership in the House and I posted what Sam Smith (Speaker)said he would do and remember the Republicans have the majority vote of the house of Reps.... Last I heard, maybe 5-3 in favor of a resolution supporting legislation transferring regulatory control of Sunday hunting to the PGC.
that is NOT what I posted/said .. I said they (BOC) did not have a MAJORITY in favor of Sunday hunting.... I even have a PM where you state the same thing.. they really do not want Sunday hunting.. I was not talking about transferring anything... So which is right --- what you are posting here or what you write in the PM as to their feelings about Sunday Hunting...?????
post edited by Dr. Trout - 2011/05/28 21:11:45
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dpms
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 21:16:07
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I think I said here and in PM several places that the BOC is split on both the regulatory transfer and the issue of Sunday hunting. I suspect 5-3 in favor of for both right now if I had to venture to guess. That is close enough to be split in my mind. Could tilt either way. Regardless of the numbers, there is not overwhelming support among our current board and that is usually what is needed for a resolution to be offered. It is an issue that has the potential of being very dynamic. The NRA was just here and lobbied the legislators hard on Sunday hunting. The NRA has pull just as the Pa. Farm Bureau has pull with the general assembly. The Farm Bureau hasn't faced the momentum that is building until recently. Be intersting to see if it fizzles out or continues to build.
post edited by dpms - 2011/05/28 21:23:43
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Dr. Trout
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 21:26:11
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This Sunday thing on this site is just like the crossbows debates... one or two out of 2,000 some members sharing their opinions on one side and the same 4 or 5 guys stating theirs on the other side, always including "digs" about the "other side" .. so you get no responses from others...
not that I mind being on the receiving end of the "digs".. after 9 years here I am soooooooooo use to it on this site.
I just wish that ONCE the guys sending me supportive PMs would repsond on the board on some subject
just like the crossbows.. I'll let you guys agree amoung yourselves.. I have stated my opinion...
I said the crossbows would be approved and was right and I'm saying Sunday Hunting is NOT in the future for the next 4-5 years.... PERIOD... good night... off to catch up on today's Casey Anthony testimony videos...
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Dr. Trout
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 21:39:14
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I suspect 5-3 in favor of for both right now if I had to venture to guess. That is close enough to be split in my mind. Could tilt either way If it is 5-3 in favor why would it tilt ???? If it COULD tilt then I would have to say no one has made up their mind for sure .. and that would mean there is no majority in favor OF SUNDAY HUNTING ... just like I said... ????
post edited by Dr. Trout - 2011/05/28 21:41:45
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bingsbaits
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 22:19:38
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Sure hope you don't call using "your" own words against you a dig.....
"There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
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RE: House G&F Sunday hunting meeting
2011/05/28 23:26:56
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As far as just ONE DAY extra to hunt, that the only opportunity or increased opportunity that make it worth while for many to hunt. Many work with Sunday being the only day off. Most have no clue who decides if Sunday hunting should be allowed and as more are pizzed off at the PGC our sport has and only will continue to decline. Most of the kids also have activities on Saturday and Sunday is the only day to hunt the whole day. Funny how all the states (how many now ?) are all wrong allowing hunting on Sundays even down in the bible belt !
post edited by Outdoor Adventures - 2011/05/28 23:27:41
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