retired guy
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Wed March 30
Went up Tues afternoon and got there about 6 PM watched the LFZ guys for a while and it was SLOW- guy said he had been there for two days with only 7 or 8 fish on. Saw a piebald yearling just East of Utica on the way up. Very little pressure below Altmar and a lot of guys in LFZ. Wed was a nice clear day in the mid 40s. Very little action in LFZ in Am so went for a long long walk on a feeder for about 6 hours in the afternoon. Lots of fish on beds. Fish not hitting anything in my box despite practically bouncing stuff off their noses time and time again before they spooked a bit and moved off. They came right back real soon. The fish on the beds werent laying eggs as yet but just lying there together-mostly in twos but occasionally 3 or more. Little pressure and they were not spooky at all when you got away from the roads and parking areas..Watched them a lot and only saw one pair 'working'. Still snow in the woods. Had 3 fish on all day and none landed- a real good time though on Wed just seeing so many in the feeder. Loved it. This morning ( Thurs) woke up to a drizzel on a very overcast day in the mid 30s. Watched the LFZ for a while and SLOW was being polite.. Winterized again just in case and came home a day early. Very nice trip but--- Guess the best is yet to come. BTW- messed up and did NOT bring garden hackle--getting forgetful as well as old.
post edited by retired guy - 2011/03/31 23:19:42
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dimebrite
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/03/31 20:32:21
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Thanks for the report retired. Sounds like you enjoyed yourself.Heard through the grapevine some freshies were caught today down low.
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jonnyfishon
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/03/31 20:42:40
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How did you forget the hackle? Gotta pull out all the guns man. That great though. Its nice to see those great fish doing there thing in the wild. Let them breed and have lots of babies.
fishon
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retired guy
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/01 18:47:57
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Those fresh fish still coming in confirm my earlier post about fresh fish on the beds I have seen over the years in April or May during those old annual spring trips.. Clearly they are NOT just fresh looking drops but some that are truly just arriving for a couple of week spawn and then OUT.
Never was around all Winter to see and understand the whole picture when it comes to Steel till getting my place up there.
The fish on the beds in the feeder were a mix of black looking fish that have been there all winter and some real clean looking new arrivals.
Saw one huge male that I first thought was a HO. He was with two other steel and he made them look small. He was very much darker than they were and had to be in the very high teens-at least. Probably the biggest Steel I ever saw- I left them alone--great genes.
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retired guy
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/03 09:07:06
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Am having a bit of a problem fly fishing the LFZ and looking for advice-- I try and keep as little weight on my line as possible realizing that some is needed as the fish are holding at the bottom. Understanding the law says you have to be able to Fly fish" with your weight I dont use so much that I have to "chuck and duck". I am NOT getting to the bottom and I am not bouncing at all except for a bit perhaps if I hold and let the line dangle below me. Yes- I am casting a bit upstream and having to 'tend' a time or two but its still not getting down. I find that if I use enough weight to get down ( tried it once for a cast or two) I am using a LOT of weight. I should note that most of those around me are in fact using a lot of weight and seem to hook up far mor than I do as the result. Could it be that I am using an 8 1/2 5 wt and most guys are using 12 or 13 foot rods. Do those rods 'handle' the greater weight better. I should point out that to me a LOT is a couple of number 7s and I have trouble working my line and casting with more than that. I have been using 2 or sometimes 3 number 20s for weight. Am I being too careful trying to obey the law and traditionally cast? Lot of productive guys in LFZ appear to be using far larger weights than I even carry. BTW- I have been using #8 through #12 black stones most of the time on a 6 lb drennan leader about 8 feet long.
post edited by retired guy - 2011/04/03 09:09:45
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dimebrite
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/03 10:19:16
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Hey retired id say your rod is like shooting pool with rope. In my opinion; for the approach you are taking to catch steel requires a bit more of a stick. You will find a lot more ease and less effort with a 10' and up 7 weight. I was up a month ago with a first time fly guy. I had him set up with a 10' medium action 7 weight switch rod. On the third day he was comfortably rolling out 30 foot casts with it. I was fishing a 13' 7 weight and overloading it with a 9 weight wf extended line. When I let him try my rig from time to time I had a hard time getting it back from him. With that rod you can handle 30-40' of line effortlessly without having to strip anything in. When casting that rod on a downstream swing I can come close to rolling the whole line out. Back hand cast; I throw the whole line. Not that these distances are necessary but a longer rod I think will help solve your problem. Then there's my 14'3" 9 weight... we wonteven go there:) im gonna be up the weekend of the 15th. Maybe one of these days our lines will cross somewhere or another. Tight lines.
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retired guy
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/03 11:16:30
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Thanks Dime, Thats pretty much the answer that seemed to be getting clearer each time I went up this winter. When I got a lot of line out I had to reduce the weight so much I had to traditionally cast and then it rode the current real high. I caught a nice number of fish but it was not what I was seeing the regulars do in any way. I have some 10 wts around 9 ft long I use for sharks and this 8 1/2 5wt. Actually I'm seeing most guys using the longer fly rods even for the sharks over the past few years. There was a time when most everyone used the 9 foot rods----guess I'm stuck with an old fashioned system and have to upgrade all around. You know by now I dont have to catch all the fish in the river to be a happy camper but it would be nice to be a bit more competitive. Guess I'll keep the stuff I'm using now for the feeders.
post edited by retired guy - 2011/04/03 11:20:19
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dimebrite
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/03 11:50:51
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ORIGINAL: retired guy
Thanks Dime,
 When I got a lot of line out I had to reduce the weight so much I had to traditionally cast and then it rode the current real high.
I caught a nice number of fish but it was not what I was seeing the regulars do in any way.
sounds like you were doing it better than most of the regulars...
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retired guy
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/03 11:56:37
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Roll and SPLASH didnt appeal to me too much. If I wanted to do that -coulda gone downstream and joined the crowd with muzzel loader balls . Still getting used to the real fly fishing on the river though after all these years but it clearly AINT like Brookie fishing up in Nova. Guess I gotta stop thinking like that. Saw a guy on a feeder this week with a weight on his fly rod that honestly looked like a .45 cal ball.
post edited by retired guy - 2011/04/03 12:00:14
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hot tuna
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/03 20:02:24
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ORIGINAL: retired guy
Am having a bit of a problem fly fishing the LFZ and looking for advice--
I try and keep as little weight on my line as possible realizing that some is needed as the fish are holding at the bottom. Understanding the law says you have to be able to Fly fish" with your weight I dont use so much that I have to "chuck and duck".
I am NOT getting to the bottom and I am not bouncing at all except for a bit perhaps if I hold and let the line dangle below me. Yes- I am casting a bit upstream and having to 'tend' a time or two but its still not getting down.
I find that if I use enough weight to get down ( tried it once for a cast or two) I am using a LOT of weight. I should note that most of those around me are in fact using a lot of weight and seem to hook up far mor than I do as the result.
Could it be that I am using an 8 1/2 5 wt and most guys are using 12 or 13 foot rods. Do those rods 'handle' the greater weight better. I should point out that to me a LOT is a couple of number 7s and I have trouble working my line and casting with more than that. I have been using 2 or sometimes 3 number 20s for weight. Am I being too careful trying to obey the law and traditionally cast? Lot of productive guys in LFZ appear to be using far larger weights than I even carry.
BTW- I have been using #8 through #12 black stones most of the time on a 6 lb drennan leader about 8 feet long.
2 things cause this: 1: you are casting to much line in too deep water 2. Not keeping your fly line out of the water (aka highsticking)and creating drag thus sweeping your line to the surface. .................. You can make a shorther (closer) cast upstream and mend your line > First as it hits the water > Second as it is at 12 o-clock to you.. Thats where you should hit bottom. Or You can add length to your leader.. I would use 9' leader and cast only to where you'll make contact with the bottom as it is straight out in front. Throw and indicator on also and you'll get to the bottom ;) It's not about adding weight, it's more about adjusting your fishing. BTW: Most of those long Rodders (13 footers Plus ) are using very LONG leaders.
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retired guy
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/03 21:18:09
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Thanks Tuna -I most likely have been out too far for my rod and the line is a definat problem dragging- I have had to Tend at least twice causing slack in the line.
Thanks again.
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dimebrite
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/04 07:05:52
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Hey retired, tunas points and observations are 100% right. But I still think your rod is a little small and light. Good luck.
Hey tuna its about time you started poking around in here again.its good to see you posting.
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draketrutta 
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/04 09:29:46
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ORIGINAL: hot tuna
2 things cause this:
1: you are casting to much line in too deep water
2. Not keeping your fly line out of the water (aka highsticking)and creating drag thus sweeping your line to the surface.
x2 also - use bead-headed (or wire-wrapped) flies (you can legally add up to 1/8 oz of weight to the fly. I know this may not be as effective as the tried & true method of the LFZ (line them with a size #24 flea flicker fly), but that's all I've got. I steer clear of that stretch.
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retired guy
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/04 12:12:28
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Hi Drake
Agree- went to the beaded head cause it did seem to hit bottom more often- had good luck with them too.
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hot tuna
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/04 18:26:51
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If we can get the water temps to 40 deg. the Big Ugly's will rule.. 
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dimebrite
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/04 20:00:49
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ORIGINAL: hot tuna
If we can get the water temps to 40 deg. the Big Ugly's will rule..
hoping for 40 plus next weekend when im up...im looking to throw some pink buggers and intruders for starters...
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retired guy
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/04 21:24:09
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Stuck with budget hearings and other related meetings for 2 darn weeks up coming. Hope to be up mid to later April.
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jcy110
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/04 22:06:30
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You are supposed to be retired..........enough! LOL
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retired guy
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/05 09:09:50
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Got a little more than 2 years left on this term- am already thinking about opting out on my next election-
When I retired said OK now all hunting and fishing -that was 9 years ago-- maybe Ill get there sometime.
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draketrutta
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/07 06:25:13
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ahhhh - the budgetary process,,,
When it gets to the 5th and 6th revision, I love watching the departmental managers eyes roll back in their head like a blue whacking a bunker..
LMAO
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retired guy
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RE: Wed March 30
2011/04/07 08:26:26
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Ahh- another participant perhaps-- Yea, we started out low and tight for the past 5 years- Thats a long time trying to maintain zero increases. Makes a long hard process each year but I wish all Govt had done this same thing. In a City of 60,000 with 10,000 School kids we saw it coming. Everyone wants cuts- but - not anything that affects them. Last time I was UP there was an op/ed in the Syracuse paper saying pretty much this same thing. Till that changes- nothing will change. Just happy that Budget season and Deer season are far apart.
post edited by retired guy - 2011/04/08 19:00:00
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