ORIGINAL: Rpgyard
This is why only land owners should be able to vote!

You are correct.  Of course, the average mis-educated dolt out there doesn't understand this and thinks the history of this country began around 1960 and that the Constitution includes foolish ideas like everyone is equal; the drunken, degenerate, drug addict's vote should count the same as the hard-working father of four's vote, or the illiterate, uneducated welfare dependent's vote should count the same as the guy who worked three jobs to put himself through college and improve his station in life.  To believe this sort of nonsense, you have to be fully invested in the lie of equality.  Most people know its a lie, but are afraid to say it. Sometimes you can't blame them. They have been spoonfed these lies their whole lives and aren't intelligent enough to think for themselves. The lie is comforting to them.  


"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”

- Joseph Goebbels

What the hell are you talking about?

--

the fish swim freely throughout the stream, its not like the landowner is keeping them all to himself

Rhnstn:  I grew up along Little Beaver Creek, a stocked troutstream.  Every year for 2 weeks, our property was trashed along the creek and we did have some problems with occasional drunks and vandals.  I can completely understand anyone who posts their property.....but many cannot.

ORIGINAL: RhnstnCowboy

ORIGINAL: Rpgyard
This is why only land owners should be able to vote!

You are correct.  Of course, the average mis-educated dolt out there doesn't understand this and thinks the history of this country began around 1960 and that the Constitution includes foolish ideas like everyone is equal; the drunken, degenerate, drug addict's vote should count the same as the hard-working father of four's vote, or the illiterate, uneducated welfare dependent's vote should count the same as the guy who worked three jobs to put himself through college and improve his station in life.  To believe this sort of nonsense, you have to be fully invested in the lie of equality.  Most people know its a lie, but are afraid to say it. Sometimes you can't blame them. They have been spoonfed these lies their whole lives and aren't intelligent enough to think for themselves. The lie is comforting to them.  


"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”

- Joseph Goebbels

 
 
Congratulations!  A new low, even for this forum.
 
Now we're getting quotes from Nazis, and not just any Nazi,
but the leader of the anti-Semitic propaganda, and chief force
behind the extermination of Jews. 
 

The world without private property: 

5 miles of Elk Creek exist
Fishermen want it open to fishing and stocked with lake run trout
Farmers want to plow it under and plant grapes
Coal companies want to mine it
Electric companies want to dam it
Nudists want to make it a camp
Bird watchers want it birdie
Evian wants to bottle it
Those in government want re-elected and want some private fishing land only they can use.
Let the war of all against all begin.
Guess what would become of the fishery....

With private property:
People try to work with each other, and often, they must agree to disagree. 
Some parts of Elk are off limits.
Most parts are not.

Based on the options, I'll take private property over the tragedy of the commons and war politics any day.

ORIGINAL: RhnstnCowboy

ORIGINAL: Rpgyard
This is why only land owners should be able to vote!

You are correct.  Of course, the average mis-educated dolt out there doesn't understand this and thinks the history of this country began around 1960 and that the Constitution includes foolish ideas like everyone is equal; the drunken, degenerate, drug addict's vote should count the same as the hard-working father of four's vote, or the illiterate, uneducated welfare dependent's vote should count the same as the guy who worked three jobs to put himself through college and improve his station in life.  To believe this sort of nonsense, you have to be fully invested in the lie of equality.  Most people know its a lie, but are afraid to say it. Sometimes you can't blame them. They have been spoonfed these lies their whole lives and aren't intelligent enough to think for themselves. The lie is comforting to them.  


"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”

- Joseph Goebbels

The only problem I see with that is although non-property owners don't pay property taxes, they do pay income, sales and other taxes. To not let this group vote seems to me to be the definition of "taxation without representation". Something the founding fathers were trying to get away from.

I own 47 acres. On monday I counted 8 hunters. I talked to a guy gettin into his truck that was parked on my access road. I asked him if he had permission to hunt, he said he's been hunting here for years. I mentioned how its posted, and he aint ever called me to ask. He says to me you cant just post it (thinking I just posted it) and not give anyone a chance to find a new spot. I tell him its been posted since 2004. Now I dont hunt, dont really care if they find a new spot or not. I have 10 signs up with all my contact info and not one call in 5 years from anyone. This one guy put me over the edge. It can happen real easy, you really should ask. I should mention I didn't really care that they were hunting, the signs are for the quads and dirtbikes. His attitude about MY land made my decision. I am fuming over it. I will be there tomarrow throwing everyone that i find off.

ORIGINAL: vmises

The world without private property: 

5 miles of Elk Creek exist
Fishermen want it open to fishing and stocked with lake run trout
Farmers want to plow it under and plant grapes
Coal companies want to mine it
Electric companies want to dam it
Nudists want to make it a camp
Bird watchers want it birdie
Evian wants to bottle it
Those in government want re-elected and want some private fishing land only they can use.
Let the war of all against all begin.
Guess what would become of the fishery....

With private property:
People try to work with each other, and often, they must agree to disagree. 
Some parts of Elk are off limits.
Most parts are not.

Based on the options, I'll take private property over the tragedy of the commons and war politics any day.

Take that cancer Donny Beaver out of the picture and you got a deal!

ORIGINAL: mikevn1500

I own 47 acres. On monday I counted 8 hunters. I talked to a guy gettin into his truck that was parked on my access road. I asked him if he had permission to hunt, he said he's been hunting here for years. I mentioned how its posted, and he aint ever called me to ask. He says to me you cant just post it (thinking I just posted it) and not give anyone a chance to find a new spot. I tell him its been posted since 2004. Now I dont hunt, dont really care if they find a new spot or not. I have 10 signs up with all my contact info and not one call in 5 years from anyone. This one guy put me over the edge. It can happen real easy, you really should ask. I should mention I didn't really care that they were hunting, the signs are for the quads and dirtbikes. His attitude about MY land made my decision. I am fuming over it. I will be there tomarrow throwing everyone that i find off.

It's your right to do so, but please be careful. As many of us heard, there was a land owner / bear hunter incident last week that resulted in shots fired and the land owner was killed. I am not saying anyone would deserve it but it is in people minds and may play into their thinking if confronted. As a hunter I am sorry that this happened, but I understand your reasoning.

In Response to Mikevn1500

I would call the police in that situation. If there are No Trespassing signs up and people are there without permission, ignoring the signs, and are in possession of a gun, then I would think twice about confronting them personally.

I cannot understand why people complain about property being posted anyway. Is it because they do not have access to the fish, or they just want to have areas to fish to themselves? There are fish ALL OVER the streams. Is it because they do not like standing in a line of 20 other guys trying to catch fish? Well, they should get over it. Everyone else stands with the crowds, and quite often, they catch fish. Try it, you may even make some friends. Anyhow, if property owners opened up their areas to everyone, it would turn into the same situation we have on non-posted areas. I agree.....take a friggin' walk and find some new areas.

I grew up hunting in somerset county in PA.....Call it youthful brashness, stupidity or whatever, but signs were generally ignored....if the ownders approached us, we left, no complaints.....we were good kids and just wanted to hunt.....the owners complained fences were damaged or gates left open (not by us per se) and so they posted their property....we never asked permission, mostly because it seemed a waste of time as it was assumed the answer would be a resounding no.
 
My mentality on fishing is a Montana philosophy:  no one owns the stream beds and they should be open to the public.  If you trespass or don't trespass, that won't magically make the signs come down.  And I don't believe it will make more signs appear....Somewhere, at some point, someone screwed up big time on private land leading to the signage....Too many signs will lead to an eminent domain issue for the courts down the road as fishing is seen as a boon to the local economy.....Just to be clear, I believe asking permission is a good idea.  What you do with the response is something only you can determine.