Trout, you're seriously a complete joke.  You always whine about what you just did .. put words into people's mouth.     Where did I belittle anyone?  I'm stating the facts.  Get over it.
 
I already know hunter success rates off hand.  
 
Archery is 19-22% and rifle is 35-40% annually.
 
 
 
 
 

...and please answer my question Trout. 
 
 
Since it was apparant the buck I shot this year was acting rutty, I shouldn't have shot it ??

By the way I did not single you out as belittling anyone  (read what I wrote)


However you wrote ----

I'm stating the facts.  Get over it.

I already know hunter success rates off hand.  

Archery is 19-22% and rifle is 35-40% annually.

In 2004-2005 bowhunters took 62,460 deer out of 409932 total.  That's 15%.

SNEAKY SILVER.....

But have no fear.. I'll set the record straight ---



that's 15% of the total deer killed were killed by archers
that's not what the individual "hunter success rate" is..

you know ----    a persons' odds of getting a deer...... 




here's how hunter succss breaks down for that year....



30% of rifle hunters shot a deer

25% of archers shot a deer

19% of muzzleloader hunters shot a deer...

so as you can see the hardest is muzzleoader hunting for deer.....
NOT ARCHERY.....

For rifle hunters I used the total general license sold... that included non resident small game (2,591 hunters) and also meant that I counted every license holder as being out there hunting deer... some archers, for example, probably had all their tags filled, and some license holders don't hunt deer... but you get the idea anyhow.......... 
 
 
just the facts JACK !!!!

Watched a nice 6pt. mount a small yearling doe last nite after about 20 seconds ma ma doe came over and pushed him and ran him off. Awsome nite plenty of deer moving.

ORIGINAL: S-10

Wellll--not exactly







HARRISBURG - Although Pennsylvania's whitetail rut may peak in mid November, breeding activity continues into the state's regular firearms deer

Hal Korber/PGC Photo


season, according to a recent four-year study conducted by the Pennsylvania Game Commission.
"Our research has confirmed that Pennsylvania's bucks still are actively pursuing does, particularly younger ones, at the outset of our firearms season," noted Dr. Gary Alt, Game Commission Deer Management Section supervisor. "The peak in breeding for adult females is mid-November, but for female fawns it occurs in early December.

"This peak in fawn breeding, however, doesn't represent a high point in overall breeding activity because there are fewer fawns in the population and a lower percentage of them breed. About 90 percent of the adult does checked in the study had conception dates ranging from Oct. 27 to Dec. 10; fawns, from Nov. 5 to Jan. 16.

"For years, we thought and reported Pennsylvania's rut peaked the week before Thanksgiving, when deer are provided closed season protection. That information was accurate, but it didn't tell the whole story. Now, thanks to this groundbreaking research, we have a clearer picture: Pennsylvania bucks aren't really cooling their jets in the pursuit of the opposite sex until well into December during our traditional firearms seasons."

Launched in 2000, the four-year deer conception study aimed to answer questions about pregnancy rates, the peak and range of the rut; when fawns are born, and the number of young carried per doe. Across the state, Wildlife Conservation Officers, biologists and other agency personnel collected data from road-killed deer. In all, 3,180 deer were examined.

well i agree to some point. BUT alot of people cant shoot a bow either and they still hunt with one. and plenty of deer get wounded with a bow. Thats also a main reason i dont flintlock..i cant shoot them...i know i cant..i tried not to say i wont try again just take shots at under 30..but thenn agian i might as well have my bow. So thats what i do, i use my bow instead of a flintlock. ALTHOUGH, if i didnt have a buck i might try the flintlock just do to i wouldnt have to pull back a string and cuase movement to alert deer. they are a bit spookier and wiser after the season its hard to pull back with no leaves on the tree. but i'd definetly be practicing with it.   I think it would be interesting to have the season. two days, during the early inline season, have the first day of the season and the last day of the season able to shoot a buck. hmmm? maybe?

s-10 makes a good point... you have to adjust for successful hunters..
 
here's one no one will believe....
 
USING THE SAME YEAR THAT SILVER MENTIONED BUT ONLY COUNTING BUCKS
 
you get something totally different when it comes to hunter success rates...
 
1 in 10 archery hunters shot a buck....
 
here's the part you won't believe..
 
that's the same rate for rifle.. 1 in 10 harvested a buck that year........
 
I got there using S-10 post..
 
total bucks shot minus all the ones in archery
 
total hunters minus all the successful buck hunters in archery...they couldn't shot a buck in rifle... so actaully were not hunting bucks...
 
results... same sucess rate.....
 
INTERESTING...
 
 
since so many say it is easier with a rifle ?????????????
 
 
 

I read most of this thread which sure got out of control from the origional poster.And I have to agree with Big Tuna Flintlock hunters got the short end of the stick when it comes to taking a buck.I started flintlock hunting in the mid 70's.Spent many a day which was my favorite hunting of the season.And never saw a Buck.Odds may be a bit better now.But I Agree flinters deserve atleast a few days before Reg. Rifle season.

My opinion, It would be cool to see an early muzzleloader season for buck starting the week buck season starts now, then start buck the following week. I hunt using a compound bow, crossbow, shotgun, pistol, rifle and muzzleloader and I enjoy the compound bow the most, mainly due to the weather being a little nicer and more comfortable.
 
My wish for big game hunting season:
 
October 1- October 31 Regular archery (Buck Only)
 
October 15- October 31 Crossbow and regular archery (Buck and doe)
 
December 1- December 8 Muzzleloader (inline or flintlock), regular archery and crossbow
 
December 1- December 8 Senior and Junior deer (Buck only)
 
December 9- December 23 regular deer season (Buck only)
 
December 26- December 31 (Doe only)
 
January 1- January 31 Muzzleloader (flintlock only),Archery, Crossbow, as it is now!
 
Antler restrictions as they are!
 
Just my thoughts on a perfect hunting season! I would even like to see doe season back to 3 days. 
 
 

I agree they are both only 100 yard guns. My honest opinion would upset alot of people. I would love to see shotgun only in PA period, and yes I own quite a few rifles. I have only harvested a couple doe with my muzzleloader. It did not fire a couple times which is pretty cool watching the deer walk away. Anyone that says its easy to shoot a buck while their hot on the doe's must have never been hunting! Every deer I see chasing a doe continue to do so with very little chance of getting a shot with a bow, I don't take more than 25-30 yard shots with my bow, but could easily kill a deer at 100 yards or more with a flintlock. It would be very unfair and not too challenging to shoot a buck with a muzzleloader in prime rut. I could sell all my other guns and bows and tag out every year if they opened muzzleloader during prime rut.
 
My theory on the way the seasons should be laid out is archery first (most difficult), then add the weapons in that have more range as the season goes, ending with rifle where it is fairly easy to shoot a deer at 150-200 yards.

ORIGINAL: S-10

What's the difference between a inline and single shot rifle?  Carefull, it's loaded

 
I'll bite,
IMO the only difference in the hands of the average hunter are these
1- The 1st is loaded thru the barrel and the 2nd is loaded from the breech.
2- the 1st takes longer to load then the 2nd
 
As far as I'm concerned they are both high power rifles. My inline is just as deadly as my .06
Mike
 

My group with the round balls in my flintlock is 7 to 8 inches. That group puts you in the kill zone every time. The only time it doesn't is when the gun doesn't fire.

ME TOO

Most good flintlocks are capable of better groups than that. The history books tell of 300 yard kills on the battlefield and 100 yard turkey shoots where you were shooting at a turkeys head or closest to an X on a tree. I'am not even close to that but there has been that type shooting and better at trapper and frontiersmen conventions, one held near my home every year. 

Yea a 7 or 8 inch group a a 100yds is very marginal shooting,a lot of wounded deer,aim at the middle of the chest,could mean low brisket,graze through meaty part of neck,gut shot,graze on top of back,high leg hit,or a deer hit in the vitals,to iffy for me,I resect the deer I hunt and try my best to kill not wound. Just my opinion not wanted a war,Big Fathead if you ok with your shooting that's all that matters.I've killed 16 with my flint and grazed 4 with no blood, one had three drops of blood so I think she lived. By the way I shoot  a 1 1/2 three shot group at 50 yds and leave it at that,flint is a challenge like bow hunting the idea to me is to get CLOSE to the deer,If I wanted to shot a doe over a 100 yds I can do that with my 270.I've shot quite a few just standing up out of there bed while still hunting a beddiing area or set up a ambush spot from bedding to feeding area,getting close is all about the hunt,to each his own.

Anatomy of a Trophy Whitetail Deer
Why is this location, of the shot placement I just described, so great and effective.  First off, you have the large scapula (shoulder blade) of the front shoulder.  A bullet placed here will put a deer down on the ground, in it's tracts, even if a vital area isn't hit.  Think of all these vitals that are only inches away from this shot placement:  The heart, about 3 to 7 inches low and a little to the back.  The neck, spine, esophagus, with major arteries just a few inches to a foot in front.  The spine, 3 to 7 inches above and continuing to the back of this location.  And lastly, you have the lungs and liver; the size of a basketball, about 3 to 12 inches covering an area towards the tail.  What does this mean to you, the trophy deer hunter who has the largest whitetail buck of lifetime, right there in front of you.  If your lucky, you will have one opportunity to get a shot off at him.  Lets look at the shot placement's kill zone's approximate dimensions; the area is about a minimum of 14 inches in hieght by about 24 inches in length.  Just a little bit bigger then the size of it's heart, isn't it?.  My question then is, can you put a bullet in that box?  Of course you can.  You now are a successful trophy deer hunter.
Archery Hunting