baby lund
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too many fish
why are so many fish sitting at trout run,godfrey and other stream mouths. half of them are pretty much dead. i know for breading-how many to they need for breading?
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pafisher
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/19 22:25:58
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I really have no idea how many they nead for "breading",but I don't think I'd like the taste of that bread.On second thought maybe it would n't be too bad smoked.
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Dream Catcher
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/19 23:42:40
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dErRRR naWTT DEEaD dUUd SAbrINaa puutz Em bAaCk dEVouId oV eGGss / saBrIna DOess AloTt oF bReeAdinG & ssMokinG aWt dE iGpeNs .. cEE yooU dErE / lit Me nO K?
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baby lund
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/19 23:46:17
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breeding instead of breading
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ShutUpNFish 
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/19 23:53:53
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They are waiting for the room! See, they take a number and whenever someone up stream ropes one, another fish is permitted up through the gates to Hell. PA stocks so many fish to accomodate everyone that even Jethrow and Goober have the opportunity to become guides! No offense to the real guides who know who they are! When you're talking hundreds of thousands of fish, of course, they are going to be everywhere unaturally!
post edited by ShutUpNFish - 2008/12/20 01:17:26
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Mr.Slickfish
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/20 08:07:54
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So it's like a firecode at the bar. I thought only the prettiest and coolest fish got to come up.
I don't always snag fish, but when I do... I choose Little Cleos I'm the best looking smartest snagging poacher alive...
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elephanthead
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/20 10:49:00
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Couldn't hold it in could you. LOL Dave ORIGINAL: ShutUpNFish
They are waiting for the room! See, they take a number and whenever someone up stream ropes one, another fish is permitted up through the gates to Hell. PA stocks so many fish to accomodate everyone that even Jethrow and Goober have the opportunity to become guides! No offense to the real guides who know who they are! When you're talking hundreds of thousands of fish, of course, they are going to be everywhere unaturally!
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Dream Catcher
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 10:49:39
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I know what you meant just razz'n . I do not know how many but they milk the eggs/milt that are needed to be incubated and hatched . I believe 900,000 steelhead smolts are stocked each year by the PFBC. If each female has 20,000 eggs with a egg/smolt death rate of 50% that would be 10,000 smolt per fish or 900 females. As for males I have no clue but being steel are so easy to catch they must be really inbred so I would say 1 daddy to 90,000 steel ??? LOL ........ Along with 100,000 brown trout that I would assume the eggs/milt come from New York? This is a grand total of 1,000,000 fiash per year not including the work of 3CU and other cooperative sportmens efforts.
I was told that after they are milked for milt / eggs they then release the fish into fishable portions of the tributaries. Steelhead are not supposed to die after spawn like salmon . I bet some folks on here know they exact figures that could chime in.
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SteelheadJim
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 12:45:54
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On the west coast it is known that about 2/3 of steelheads die from the rigors of spawning. At least that is what I have read over the years in the many books I have read. That figure seems high to me. I have no idea if the Great lakes fish numbers are comparable.
post edited by SteelheadJim - 2008/12/21 12:47:27
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carpitiss
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 18:48:16
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yea, i really don't think they need to stock that many fish in a stream deemed as nursery waters. i guess it creates a good shoreline fishery, but once the fish are in the stream nobody can fish for them. they certainly don't need that many for breeding. they should just stock more in other streams where they can be caught because you know there just aren't enough steelhead in the streams that are open to fishing .....
Caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrppppppp!!!!
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KISHWAA
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 20:42:36
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ORIGINAL: Dream Catcher
they must be really inbred so I would say 1 daddy to 90,000 steel ??? LOL
.
YOU GOTTA ASK A WEST VIRGINIAN ABOUT THAT PART THEYLL GET THE NUMBERS RIGHT FOR YALL.... LOL
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jeeters
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 21:23:23
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why could'nt the fish commission take those surplus fish out of trout run , godfrey run and other nursery waters and put them in a fish com. lake somewhere? most of those fish just lay there from october till march and by that time they are just about dead from fungus and other overcrowding problems.Just think - having a place to fish for steel when the tribs are blown out would be awsome, that was the one good thing about the pig pen back in the day.
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KJH807
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:22:47
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ORIGINAL: baby lund
why are so many fish sitting at trout run,godfrey and other stream mouths. half of them are pretty much dead. i know for breading-how many to they need for breading?
there really aren't that many compared to other streams... its just that they get can only go 100ft from the lake the PFBC removes fish for breeding, once they are done the brood stock gets put in various tribs ORIGINAL: carpitiss
yea, i really don't think they need to stock that many fish in a stream deemed as nursery waters. i guess it creates a good shoreline fishery, but once the fish are in the stream nobody can fish for them. they certainly don't need that many for breeding. they should just stock more in other streams where they can be caught because you know there just aren't enough steelhead in the streams that are open to fishing .....
fish aren't stocked in trout run
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Stillhead
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:34:07
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ORIGINAL: KJH807
fish aren't stocked in trout run
huh? Yes they do stock it.
post edited by Stillhead - 2008/12/21 22:39:55
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Stillhead
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:39:24
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ORIGINAL: jeeters
why could'nt the fish commission take those surplus fish out of trout run , godfrey run and other nursery waters and put them in a fish com. lake somewhere? most of those fish just lay there from october till march and by that time they are just about dead from fungus and other overcrowding problems.Just think - having a place to fish for steel when the tribs are blown out would be awsome, that was the one good thing about the pig pen back in the day. When all else fails, try the Bay now. It's hit or miss but when it's hit it's awesome.
They restock the spawned out fish back into the creeks where fishing is allowed. I think there have been times in the past when the just moved some fish to the other creeks without spawning them, not sure about that though. If they were to move them to other lakes, it would have to be to those inside the Lake Erie watershed due to VHS, that due to Federal law. And I doubt they'd even do it to those lakes now if it is legal just out of fear of spreading VHS anywhere. You are right though, I do miss the Pigpen and I'm not ashamed to admit it. Always somewhere to fish no matter what. Although usually when I fished there the wind was blowing northwest 30+mph, waves crashing over the marina breakwall.
post edited by Stillhead - 2008/12/21 22:41:38
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carpitiss
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:41:09
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steelhead aren't stalked in trout run? that's a lot of strays then!!!!
Caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrppppppp!!!!
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KJH807
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:41:16
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ORIGINAL: Stillhead
ORIGINAL: KJH807
fish aren't stocked in trout run
huh? Yes they do stock it.
really? smolts are stocked in trout run? for what purpose? I can't imagine a 100ft run to the lake would allow imprtinting
post edited by KJH807 - 2008/12/21 22:42:22
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Stillhead
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:42:51
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I'd imagine they imprint while in the raceways in the hatchery. My guess is the actual stocking would be to allow them to run out to the lake on their own.
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carpitiss
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:43:26
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i'm with you stillhead. i miss the pigpen too. uhhhhhh, the good old days of carp (i mean steelhead) fishing the way it should be.....
it was also a great place to fish at night.....
Caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrppppppp!!!!
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KJH807
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:44:23
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ORIGINAL: carpitiss
steelhead aren't stalked in trout run? that's a lot of strays then!!!!
not really, all the streams are basically the same (small) water shed with the same scent there are fish in unstocked tribs/ creeks
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Stillhead
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:44:46
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Trout Run
CONF. TRIB FROM HATCHERY: Lat: 42.044060, Long: -80.272259
CONFLUENCE WITH LK ERIE: Lat: 42.059240, Long: -80.272339
Year
Species
Lifestage
# Stocked
1991
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
100,000
1992
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
208,000
1993
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
200,000
1994
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
150,000
1995
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
140,000
1996
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
125,000
1997
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
143,048
1998
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
199,622
2000
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
220,100
2001
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
6,350
2001
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Fingerling
163,675
2002
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Yearling
180,000
2003
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Yearling
48,037
2004
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Yearling
84,750
2005
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Yearling
92,797
2006
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Yearling
83,500
2007
Rainbow Trout - Steelhead
Yearling
70,200
Total =
2,215,079
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KJH807
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:49:19
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ORIGINAL: Stillhead
I'd imagine they imprint while in the raceways in the hatchery. My guess is the actual stocking would be to allow them to run out to the lake on their own.
i think our lines are crossed my understanding... imprinting is the proccess during the psudo-smoltification of erie steelhead where there are having their "birth"/stocked location imprinted so they will know where to return our mutt strain as taken well to imprinting in our area and sees a return rate that allows it to enjoy continued stocking imprinting cannot take place in a raceway
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carpitiss
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:49:52
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ORIGINAL: KJH807
ORIGINAL: carpitiss
steelhead aren't stalked in trout run? that's a lot of strays then!!!!
not really, all the streams are basically the same (small) water shed with the same scent
there are fish in unstocked tribs/ creeks
there ARE fish in unstocked tribs, but not even close to the numbers of trout run, which would lead one to believe that many fish DO indeed imprint to exact streams where stocked.....
Caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrppppppp!!!!
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Stillhead
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:52:56
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ORIGINAL: KJH807
ORIGINAL: Stillhead
I'd imagine they imprint while in the raceways in the hatchery. My guess is the actual stocking would be to allow them to run out to the lake on their own.
i think our lines are crossed
my understanding...
imprinting is the proccess during the psudo-smoltification of erie steelhead where there are having their "birth"/stocked location imprinted
so they will know where to return
our mutt strain as taken well to imprinting in our area and sees a return rate that allows it to enjoy continued stocking
imprinting cannot take place in a raceway
I thought what was "imprinting" was the smell/scent of the water in that birth location. When that raceway is located on trout run, using water from trout run (or so I believe) then it would be completely possible for that smell to "imprint" while in the raceway. At least that was my thought. Maybe I'm wrong. Either way, steelhead are stocked into trout run.
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KJH807
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:55:26
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i didn't think it could happen on concrete but there water coming in from the stream so i guess it could happen...
what about godefrey? is there a hatchery there?
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Stillhead
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:57:14
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I'm no biologist, just a dumb fisherman, but I also believe this is why they are stocked when they are. I believe the thinking is that if they are left in the hatchery too long, they will imprint to the smell of the hatchery water, and return to trout run, rather than the other streams they might be intended for. Again, that is just a dumb fisherman's thoughts. I'd think all these could be answered with a quick stop into the fairview hatchery.
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Stillhead
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:58:40
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no, no hatchery there, but they are stocked there too. 16 mile is not stocked, according to their list. Not sure if any of the clubs stock it or not. I can tell you I caught tons of smolts there in September of this year, not sure what that was all about.
post edited by Stillhead - 2008/12/21 22:59:05
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carpitiss
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 22:59:27
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i never actually thought of that stillhead. that is a good point. not sure how true it is. i do know that smolts stocked in the upper stretches of a stream "get used to" the smell of the stream bed thus urging them to return as adults. not sure of the time frame or age needed though.....
Caaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrppppppp!!!!
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KJH807
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 23:02:11
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i remember hearing that...
its a free-for-all
i wonder if all erie tribs are stocked from the fairview hatchery...
i just can't image that would be a good idea... always the same gene pool
but no one ever accused these fish of being smart
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Stillhead
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RE: too many fish
2008/12/21 23:04:29
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I believe all the steelhead stocked by the state are now raised at the fairview hatchery, I'm not aware of another one (is the corry hatchery still in the lake Erie watershed, not sure where corry is even at). At one time I think the linesville hatchery raised allot,if not most of them, but VHS ended that.
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