WHERES THE FISH ????? 
D-nymph
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 10:47:46
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SteelSlayer77
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 12:53:40
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I also read nothing but mere speculation in the article as well...speculation by a PA biologist nonetheless...So, it had to be true! Nothing but speculation? So the fact that they know PA steel are showing up in NY and OH tribs due to the different fin clipping done by different states is speculation? The fact that they know commercial fisherman have all of a sudden started catching dramatically more sea lampreys in their nets, and are seeing more lamprey wounds on steel caught by anglers is speculation? The fact that they know we had record walleye hatches a few years before the drop off happened is speculation? At least the PFBC has acknowledged the situation, and has theories about what is going on and plans to try to correct some things by doing stuff like stocking further upstream for better stream imprinting, stocking more fish in inner east tribs that use to go to 20 mile, and by looking at possible new breeding ground areas they can treat for sea lampreys. Honestly what more do you guys think the state should be doing?
post edited by SteelSlayer77 - 2012/10/24 12:54:41
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SteelSlayer77
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 13:06:06
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genieman77
I don't fish the mouths ..never have
but as far as Trout Run.....has anyone looked at this?
1992 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 208,000
1993 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 200,000
1994Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 150,000
1995 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 140,000
1996 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 125,000
1997 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 143,048
1998 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 199,622
2000 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 220,100
2001 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 6,350
2001 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Fingerling 163,675
2002 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling 180,000
2003 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling 48,037
2004 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling 84,750
2005 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling 92,797
2006 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling 83,500
2007 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling 70,200
2008 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling 48,998
2009 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling 51,000
2010 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Small Fingerling 18,000
2010 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling49,050
2011 Rainbow Trout - Steelhead Yearling 45,750
Look at the numbers...It would seem abundantly obvious why catch rates are down
(ASSuming fish stage at their "home" creek before entering)
So if it's all due to stocking how do you explain the lower catch rates on Elk where just as many if not more fish have been stocked per year in the last 5 years compared to the previous 15? No reason they should be stocking 100,000+ steel in trout run where you have about 50 yards of shoreline to fish behind two rows of anglers. Those fish will get more bang for the buck being stocked in a stream that can actually be fished. As long as trout run is getting enough fish returning for the stocking program, then that's all they need to put in trout run.
post edited by SteelSlayer77 - 2012/10/24 13:14:30
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Loomis
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 15:43:57
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Can you explain why some people at trout run consistently catch these nonexistent fish while others don't? I always speculated it was because the fish couldn't see their powerbait. I always use a quarter size chunk...
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genieman77
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 18:47:57
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SteelSlayer77
So if it's all due to stocking....... i didn't say it was "all" due to stocking, Slayer . I haven't a clue what goes on at TR I was offering at least one possible (even likely) explanation for anglers seeing less fish in TR and/or their catch rates from shore . Seems quite logical, no? as far as Elk, my money is on the predation of smolts as being a major contributor...Not the 'only" one, but part, and perhaps a "the" major part BTW, Connie in Ohio has been off for several years too.
No reason they should be stocking 100,000+ steel in trout run where you have about 50 yards of shoreline to fish behind two rows of anglers. Those fish will get more bang for the buck being stocked in a stream that can actually be fished. As long as trout run is getting enough fish returning for the stocking program, then that's all they need to put in trout run.
I can dig it ..I'm all for it It's has nothing to do with seeing less fish at TR. Which based on the published data, would seem the obvious "major' contributor , would be...well, obvious .L.T.A.
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genieman77
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 19:02:06
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Loomis
Can you explain why some people at trout run consistently catch these nonexistent fish while others don't?
Geeze, Loomie Just when I'm ready to dub you a Trout Jedi Knight like I did your pad'ner Tim a few years ago...you go and make a rookie mistake like that don'cha know by now, it has little to do with numbers in the water (even in the leanest years there has ALWAYS been a ton of fish to catch) SO...get your pen paper out, Mister ...I want you to write 500 times "10% of the fishermen catch 90% of the fish" and turn it in by Friday morning ...or there'll be no recess for you young man.... ..L.T.A.
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SteelSlayer77
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 19:16:12
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Which based on the published data, would seem the obvious "major' contributor , would be...well, obvious Might not be as obvious as you think, why did you only highlighted the one record in that data? The 2010 stocking wasn't 18k fish, there are two records (one for fingerlings and one for yearlings). Added together they stocked 67k steelheads into trout run in 2010, the most since 2007. as far as Elk, my money is on the predation of smolts as being a major contributor...Not the 'only" one, but part, and perhaps a "the" major part
BTW, Connie in Ohio has been off for several years too. I do agree with you on that.
post edited by SteelSlayer77 - 2012/10/24 19:22:18
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genieman77
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 19:44:27
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SteelSlayer77
The 2010 stocking wasn't 18k fish, there are two records (one for fingerlings and one for yearlings). Added together they stocked 67k steelheads
duh...nevermind  ..L.T.A.
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spoonchucker
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 19:48:01
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Here's another Spoonery ( spoon theory ). Back during most of the "early" days. Few people people fished the triibs past thanksgiving. Even fewer months later, when the Smolts were stocked. Now the spring "pressure" rival that of the fall. Resulting in numerous Smolt being hooked. They ain't exactly always handled gently. In fact Iv'e seen them handled from complete disregard, to outright contempt. How many die as a result? Not only in the stream, but in the lake? Having had their jaws so damaged, that they can't take advantage of the food sources available to them there?
Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference. Step Up, or Step Aside The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody. GL
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spoonchucker
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/24 20:01:39
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OR. Perhaps Penna's mutterization of of the fish stock, has left them so screwed up genetically. That some percentage of them never develope sexually, and hence HAVE no drive to run the streams. Or have lost the trait to imprint. So they just follow whatever trail happens to be close, when "the urge" hits. Canada, NY, Ohio, where ever they are at the time.
post edited by spoonchucker - 2012/10/24 20:03:59
Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference. Step Up, or Step Aside The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody. GL
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mike55
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/25 02:22:29
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I love how the actively posting members of this board jump on people when they compare runs from past years to the current. Someone will say.. "The 80s were ridiculous there were so many fish it was insane" Translation to some of the members who stick up for there distant cousin (All erie steelhead) as if we were running down family...."There are no fish in erie, Not one fish has been caught all year, Some random deli is closing due to there being no steelhead"..
Not sure how this thread starts at "lots of fish in the 80s" to. No fish in the 10s.
My original post.... I Said I was "not" complaining because we have 50 hook up days.... That was turned into. Stop complaining, 50 fish is a lot. learn how to land them. (LOL).. There are Plenty of fish. Last years run was awesome. Simply people comparing years, Big deal...
One thing I do complain about is a state trying to sustain a run of brown trout and not implying catch and release limitations on them for a few years until there is a nice run of them. That to me, Is stupid. Like most of the people that post before they read on here.
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spoonchucker
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/25 02:46:03
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You need to grow a hide, if you wanna play in THIS shark tank. It's not a place for the thin of skin.
Just sayin.
As for the Browns. It appears the runs have been increasing each year. So it would seem that a C&R limitation wasn't/isn't necessary.
Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference. Step Up, or Step Aside The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody. GL
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mike55
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/25 03:30:32
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I agree the browns are increasing, I caught a nice one this year.. A C&R would only speed things up. Don't see why anyone would complain.. Its a brown steelhead. (tastes about the same.. right?) If they had the nerve to complain then at that point there just keeping fish to show off to whoever is at there house, not eat them. Take a picture
post edited by mike55 - 2012/10/25 03:33:07
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dano
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/25 05:08:57
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genieman77
BTW, Connie in Ohio has been off for several years too.
.L.T.A.
Same in NY People here blame the change to what the article pointed out. We used to stock fish similar to the mutt domestic rainbows that PA stocks. Now, we use the Salmon River strain. The change came after the rearing pool at the local hatchery got closed due to whirling disease. All in all, i'm OK with the numbers this year. I've been having fun.
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Bogeyjoker
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/25 08:50:54
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mike55
Last years run was awesome. Simply people comparing years, Big deal...
Sooo...the runs of the 80's and 90's were "super awesome" in comparison?
"Socialism...confuses the distinction between government and society. As a result of this, every time we object to a thing being done by government, the socialists conclude that we object to its being done at all. " Frederic Bastiat
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Loomis
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/25 09:15:45
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genieman77
Loomis
Can you explain why some people at trout run consistently catch these nonexistent fish while others don't?
Geeze, Loomie
Just when I'm ready to dub you a Trout Jedi Knight like I did your pad'ner Tim a few years ago...you go and make a rookie mistake like that
don'cha know by now, it has little to do with numbers in the water
(even in the leanest years there has ALWAYS been a ton of fish to catch)
SO...get your pen paper out, Mister ...I want you to write 500 times
"10% of the fishermen catch 90% of the fish"
and turn it in by Friday morning ...or there'll be no recess for you young man....
..L.T.A.
I mean I guess the 800-1000 fish I saw strafing the lake shore instead of 1500-2000 means a decline in numbers, either way I was too busy fighting fish the last time I was there to really care..... Ill get to working on that assignment, hopefully I can be apart of the 10%, the 90% are going to start an "Occupy Erie" Campaign if we don't get these numbers straightened out. 800 fish for 100 anglers is simply unacceptable, in my eyes.
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bigbear2010
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Re:WHERES THE FISH ?????
2012/10/25 09:43:43
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lmao
it was the aliens
they came down and probed the fish, sending their navigational systems off
as we speak they are hurling themselfs off niagra falls in an attempt to get back to their ancestrial breeding grounds, some are going to germany others to the pacifis north west....but none of them have avoided this fate
so, sorry to say to all the lurkers out there...there are no, i repeat NO steelies in any of the erie tribs this year, so stay tuned on your computer to see if that run of un-probed fish ever figure out the guidance system and come steaming into your favorite little kiddie pool, so you can break out the big yellow ropes and haul those delicious big trout home
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