CAPTAIN HOOK
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What would you like to see changed ?
Without having a heated difference of opinions what one top item or idea would you like to see changed or looked at on Steelhead fishing on Lake Erie and it's tributaries that would help ?
My personal one is allowing stream fishing to continue after the smolts are stocked ! I don't understand why after raising those fish with all problems involved to get them to that point of survival, and allow fishermen to hook, and handle, one after another, all day. I've seen it past years and learned once they stocked I'm done. I think there should be short window shut down and allow these little smolts a better chance at getting lake side.
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FishinGuy
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/11 14:14:04
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☄ Helpfulby FiveMilePete 2015/12/11 21:42:56
That's a good one. More easements and stream improvements would be nice. Something to help fish get past the madness on lower nut perhaps. I used to never fish north of rt 5 on the nut. Last 5 times I walked from rt 5 south to the set of tubes, I saw nothing at all in low clear conditions. That was my favorite stretch when I started around 2002. Now I don't fish the nut at all. Still make that walk every couple years though.
post edited by FishinGuy - 2015/12/11 14:16:49
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johnthefisherman
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/11 14:21:42
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Maybe see them lower the limit, or a size restriction.
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fisherofmen376
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/11 14:25:30
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☄ Helpfulby bingsbaits 2015/12/11 15:46:39
More supervision and enforcement of existing laws regarding limits, snagging, etc. If they lowered the limit that would be fine by me, but i don't think that's the real answer.
"Come, follow me," Jesus said, "and I will make you fishers of men." Matthew 4:19
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H3Fisher
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/11 14:29:22
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1 fish limit august 1 to november 1 then 2 fish limit from there. Fish must be 20 inches to keep.
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troutguy
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/11 15:46:22
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Good stuff so far
-More WCOs. A lot more, especially under cover ones.
-Open up the private section between Legion and Follys. Or don't allow guides to profit off of it.
-24 inch size limit; 2 fish may be kept. Until the runs improve (overall fish numbers may not be as bad as we think, it's just that they're all in the lake, so numbers for creek fishing are currently low).
-Make it rain
-Make Walnut from the waterfall down to the marina for kids 15 years old and younger.....at least on the weekends. 1 fish limit.
-Trout Run(the actual creek) for kids 10 and under on weekends. Catch and release or 1 fish limit
-Continue to work hard to decrease the lamprey numbers
Good point about the smolts Captain. Some people just stay in their spot and catch smolts left and right, then post on here saying they caught 30+. If you catch a couple within the first couple minutes of fishing a spot, move!!! Lots of people handling, sometimes poorly, large numbers of these fish isn't good. Crush those barbs!
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bingsbaits
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/11 15:49:47
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Spend the money to try and get Elk Creek deemed navigable.
Pull WCO's from around the state for a couple week stint on the tribs and hammer the hell out of the snaggers.
I love the sweet smell of Victory and the Salty taste of Liberal Tears in my coffee. BB
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SCaveNJ
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/11 17:25:38
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Take Conneaut, Elk, and Twenty Mile Creeks and impose a Delayed Harvest (DH) timeframe where it would be illegal to harvest or possess a steelhead from September 1st until December 1st. On and after December 1st, DH regulations would cease and normal limits would apply. So catch & release in the early season to give the fish a chance to work up the creeks and to give the C&R anglers plenty of opportunities. Fly, spin or pin - all are welcome.
Anglers looking to harvest can hit any of the other tribs throughout the entire season, or wait until 12/1 to harvest on these special DH streams.
I live with fear every day, and sometimes she lets me go fishing.
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pheasant tail 2
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/11 21:03:01
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Closed season April 1 through the opening day trout season
PT2
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kill3ducks1deer
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/11 21:04:59
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A larger size limit would be cool, just 20 inches, I feel like you are just below your average steel but big enough to avoid guys taking those fish that decided to run after a year.
"Fishermen are born honest, but they get over it." Ed Zern
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steelhead sam
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/12 03:47:19
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☄ Helpfulby FiveMilePete 2015/12/12 15:55:23
Designate some upstream stretches catch and release, barbless hook only. Better enforcement of current snagging laws. Find a way to lower natural predation of smoltz in the streams. This spring I saw a fairly large northern pike in 12 mile creek, wonder how many he ate over the winter? And these crommorants are totally out of control, eating huge numbers!
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FiveMilePete
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/12 16:08:47
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steelhead sam
Designate some upstream stretches catch and release, barbless hook only. Better enforcement of current snagging laws. Find a way to lower natural predation of smoltz in the streams. This spring I saw a fairly large northern pike in 12 mile creek, wonder how many he ate over the winter? And these crommorants are totally out of control, eating huge numbers!
I don't think pike are that big a problem, but I bet if you use a rainbow trout rapala off the mouths of Twenty, Walnut, and Elk, you'll probably do well on walleye. They have found their new favorite food, smolts. Stock the smolts later? After the walleye have moved to deeper water? I don't think changing the limit, barbless hooks or whatever would help. You just don't see even 10% of the number of fish that used to fill the mouths of the creeks anymore, especially on the East side. Hell, 10% is being generous. There's something else going on. It's not just keeping fish. I saw hundreds more fish caught and kept each year in the early 2000's and many more fishermen than in the last five years. It seems like there are more fishermen, because there are so few fish, concentrated in one or two spots on the creeks. On the East side that is.
post edited by FiveMilePete - 2015/12/13 00:10:36
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ZelieSam
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/12 16:16:05
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steelhead samAnd these crommorants are totally out of control, eating huge numbers! Wait, kill a bunch of birds? I could get on board with that. Seriously though, I don't care in any way what they do with this fishery.
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PAJAY
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/12 16:28:13
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I would like to see the WCO'S actually out of the EXPLORES and maybe walking around .
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FishinGuy
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/12 16:31:34
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☄ Helpfulby FiveMilePete 2015/12/13 00:01:19
5 mile Pete, You nailed it I think. Be it lampreys, walleyes, thiamine deficiency like in Lake O, or burbots eating them all. Something other than yellow rope is reducing numbers. <fakt
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CAPTAIN HOOK
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 00:31:54
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☄ Helpfulby FiveMilePete 2015/12/13 13:14:03
I'll go along with that too guys . Something else is just not 100% right . I've seen past years at Trout Run where almost everybody on the beach had their stringers filled with 5 fish limits day after day ! I'm talking big crowds like you see in those old flashback photos. If I said 200 fish a day were taken out fairly regular when the lake was flat I wouldn't be off much. The crazy thing was the next trip up was just as good. I was fortunate to see some of those huge Steelhead schools cruise the shore lines in the late 80's and they were massive ! Like I said before they looked like huge black waves of seaweed moving under the surface.
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pikepredator2
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 08:55:14
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anything having to do with the smolts would be a problem. not allowing trib fishing after they're stocked interferes with spring trout fishing. and waiting for the walleye to head for deeper water, when does that happen? late enough for the stream temps to rise high enough to not sustain the smolts? if they stock too late is imprinting possible? and again, if you wait to stock til the walleye are gone, then keep the tribs closed til the smolts migrate out, you're delaying trout fishing in the tribs til when, June? guaranteed wailing and gnashing of teeth from the trout fishermen that wait all year for the season opener.
post edited by pikepredator2 - 2015/12/13 09:37:41
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pikepredator2
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 09:11:41
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I think more fish are being kept than people realize and I can point the finger at the bait shops that offer the smoked fish exchange. Last I knew PRs offered 2 kinds, plain and cajun (don't know if that's changed) and East Erie offers like 10 varieties, don't know about the other shops. How people think giving them a fish AND $12 is a screaming deal is beyond me. Do this with 6 or 7 fish and you can get yourself a Brinkman and do it yourself. I guess if you're traveling (which so many do), this way is easier than transporting raw fish. I really think these shops are do a booming business with the smokies which is putting somewhat of a dent in the population. How much of a dent? I don't know, but you have to fill out forms every time you do an exchange so these numbers should be available from the fish commission. I'd be for a 1 fish limit but that's going to hurt because the travelers that keep their fish won't be coming up as often for 1 fish. I'd also be for closing the tribs to all fishing September 1 - October 31st to at least let a few runs get in and get scattered throughout the creeks. But if the tribs were closed for those 2 months would the crowds fishing the mouths now be unbearable? Close ALL steel head fishing Sept-Oct? That would then have to include the boats out on the lake trolling for them. Actually, the more I think about this one, the more of an interesting experiment this would make even for just 1 year. Stock the same amounts of smolts in the spring, close steelhead fishing from 1 Sep - 31 Oct (tribs, mouths, and lake), then see what kind of fishing we have in the tribs November thru March.
post edited by pikepredator2 - 2015/12/13 09:21:23
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pikepredator2
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 09:35:56
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Was actually thinking, to cut down on the crowds, about a separate steel head stamp that could be sold like doe tags, but then about 20 problems with this popped into my head. Yeah, not doable.
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genieman77
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 10:16:19
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there must be something else at play than the the "wack 'em and stack 'em" hoards
IF they're stocking the same amount as they did in 95-thru 2002, there must be something else .
cause there's NEVER been a significant amount of second year run fish..maybe for ocean run steel, but not in Erie.
the overwhelming majority of drop backs don't recover from the rigors of trying to spawn on shale gravel in shallow ditches ...not to mention being hooked (both fair and foul) countless times ..they drop back and die in the lake .
There's never been many second time spawners in Erie .."maybe" 10-15% at best
so IF stocking numbers have remained same , something else is going on.
maybe they're just not returning and defecting to Canada (too many of us peeing in the criks here)
or maybe the predators have increased (there was a Walleye hatch explosion some years ago, no?)
or maybe space invaders...but i don't believe it's the Rope 'em round up cowbooys causing it.
The Lariat Sam's certainly effect the numbers in the creeks during the season, but there's just not near as many fish returning from the get go
..L.T.A.
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Thedrift
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 12:40:13
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2 fish limit. Catch and release browns. Minimum 24inch fish.. It needs to happen.. Creating a better fishery will drive license sales and give people better experiences on the water. The main issue is water levels. If they can start stock water that would be great.
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davef
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 12:47:30
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I haven't fished the east side streams for over five years but I agree with everything fivemilepete and genieman are saying. I do think 10% of the numbers of fish from the glory years may be to high.
I haven't made as many trips over the last 4 years and all have been on the west side but I doubt if I have seen over 5 fish in that time working their way up through the riffles. It used to be there were so many they would run into your legs. I still catch a few fish and in some ways the reduction in fish is beneficial (lack of hoardes of anglers).
I still think there are enough fish to make a three hour trip worthwhile but I would hope the PFC would at least be able to make an intelligent guess as to what is going on. Maybe they just prefer to keep quiet?
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FiveMilePete
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 13:53:09
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pikepredator2
I think more fish are being kept than people realize and I can point the finger at the bait shops that offer the smoked fish exchange. Last I knew PRs offered 2 kinds, plain and cajun (don't know if that's changed) and East Erie offers like 10 varieties, don't know about the other shops. How people think giving them a fish AND $12 is a screaming deal is beyond me. Do this with 6 or 7 fish and you can get yourself a Brinkman and do it yourself. I guess if you're traveling (which so many do), this way is easier than transporting raw fish. I really think these shops are do a booming business with the smokies which is putting somewhat of a dent in the population. How much of a dent? I don't know, but you have to fill out forms every time you do an exchange so these numbers should be available from the fish commission.
I'd be for a 1 fish limit but that's going to hurt because the travelers that keep their fish won't be coming up as often for 1 fish. I'd also be for closing the tribs to all fishing September 1 - October 31st to at least let a few runs get in and get scattered throughout the creeks. But if the tribs were closed for those 2 months would the crowds fishing the mouths now be unbearable? Close ALL steel head fishing Sept-Oct? That would then have to include the boats out on the lake trolling for them. Actually, the more I think about this one, the more of an interesting experiment this would make even for just 1 year. Stock the same amounts of smolts in the spring, close steelhead fishing from 1 Sep - 31 Oct (tribs, mouths, and lake), then see what kind of fishing we have in the tribs November thru March.
That's funny!
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Guest
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 14:08:58
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Very interesting thread here . . .
Nothing really to add, but it is interesting to see here and other recent threads a lot more widespread acknowledgement that sumpthin' ain't quite right the last several years. Used to be in a thread like this, there'd be lots of "There's too many fish . . . if you can't catch a bunch something's wrong with you . . . etc, etc . . ." but that's certainly starting to change.
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Divemaster
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 15:57:58
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20 or 24" size limit with one or two fish per day during regular season. After stocking smolts there should it should be C&R fishing only, for Salmonids, that is. I don't think the tribs should be completely closed after smolts are stocked in case anglers want to fish the sucker run or for any other stream dwellers during that time of year.
Another nice thing to see as opposed to higher stocking numbers would be more habitat improvement projects, especially on walnut. I'm not even sure how steelhead are supposed to get over the waterfall hole, honestly...
More law enforcement would be a nice touch. In the four weekends I hit the tribs this fall, I didn't see one officer, yet I was able to observe countless snaggers.
Also, and this is the most important thing to me personally, PUT MORE EFFORT IN TO GETTING RID OF INVASIVES. Sea Lampreys and Round Gobies especially! The lamprey feed on many of the steelhead and more crucially to the natural OW community, Lake Trout! The gobies may also eat steelhead and brown eggs in the streams depending on how far up they climb (I can't even count all the gobies in lower 'nut during early summer) and they definitely have a major impact on lake trout spawning by eating eggs and the very, very few fry that do hatch.
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genieman77
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 18:00:29
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rsquared
Very interesting thread here . . .
Nothing really to add, but it is interesting to see here and other recent threads a lot more widespread acknowledgement that sumpthin' ain't quite right the last several years.
LOL...anyone that hasn't noticed the decline is either blind or in denial From my recollection, the serious/fast decline coincided with the record walleye hatch becoming old enough to munch lunch ..L.T.A.
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FishinGuy
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 20:20:25
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Wait wait wait. So. You're insinuating that BIG fish. .. are EATING, little fish!? Ooooohhh, see, they told me yellow ropes was eatin all them steelheads. I get it now. Makes much more sense.
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CAPTAIN HOOK
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 20:47:08
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I agree with Genieman something still isn't right. I just don't think the stocking numbers aren't there as past years. 1994 - 2003 return fish numbers were super high almost every year ! Crowds were not as congested in most areas ,but much more water was open to fish too. I'll agree the crowds are massive in some areas today. Just wonder where are the continuing runs that use to show up steady as the season progressed. I'm talking those late Fall and Winter runs of Steelhead that showed up on the lower sections first. Where they at ? I can see the first runs getting hammered but where are the late schools and packs of fish ? I can see one or two years of off number runs we had that in the 80's but five years in a row of lower returns. I'm not in denial
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Thedrift
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 21:12:38
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Too many fish are being kept plain and simple. The remainder of fish are stuck in the lake. Erie water levels are horrendous for a constant run of fish. I have been browsing these threads for years. Finally decided to make an account. It truly is amazing to see how many people were roasted for seeing this issue years before anything actually happened. 3 fish a day amongst hundreds of people is just too much. The charters destroy just as many fish before they even get to run as well. Regarding walnut. Fish can get up falls you would not believe. There are waterfalls in the feeder creeks on elk that are way bigger than those falls. Walnut is a slaughter house, stop blaming the falls for them not running up it. Those fish do not have a chance.
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FishinGuy
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Re: What would you like to see changed ?
2015/12/13 22:48:49
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Thedrift
Too many fish are being kept plain and simple.
Way off, pain and simple. Sure lowering the limit would mean more fish in the streams. There's just not the same number of fish coming in. Could be just nature rejecting the unnatural steelhead we've been stocking where they don't belong. Look. Steelhead in western rivers(where they belong) don't have the same numbers/type of predators to get past that ours do. And they're not doing any good either. There are massive numbers of walleye, Bass, and assorted trash fish all capable of gobbling dozens of smolts daily. I'm not saying there's any direct correlation between western natural fish and our steelmuts, it's just that It's not just the stringers. And I've decided that's OK with me. It may rebound, it may not. https:// youtu.be/gWL90wryyOw
post edited by FishinGuy - 2015/12/13 22:54:49
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