LAKE STAMP PETITION

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andyd8403
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/30 14:56:09 (permalink)
Where are you getting the descriptions for the original and the new stamps?  I have not been able to find why the new LE stamp was issued.  I would like to read it from the source.
 
Also looking at the records for license sale there is a discrepancy starting in 2005.  I have run the numbers in excel.  I am not a tax man or a number cruncher by profession, but something is up.  Someone else feel free to do so and make sure I am not crazy or fat fingered.

The worst day fishing is better than any day of work
#31
mohawksyd
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/30 18:55:37 (permalink)
jimmytwotime
steelhead are the only reason erie is popular anyways

 
False.

"For the supreme test of a fisherman is not how many fish he has caught...but what he has caught when he has caught no fish." - John H. Bradley

#32
chrisrowboat
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/30 23:36:33 (permalink)
Erie Sport store owner is the one pushing for it.

Proud to have been a FOT/
I've been out fishing.
Clean your gear/
http://www.fish.state.pa.us/cleanyourgear.htm



#33
deetz4352
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/30 23:49:32 (permalink)
If the price of a PA fishing license goes up then Ill still be buying one and Ill still be fishing PA waters.
 
Why you may ask ?
 
The only answer I can give to you is because I can and I will.

The Deetz
Fishermen are born honest,but they get over it
#34
bingsbaits
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/31 09:03:42 (permalink)
mohawksyd

jimmytwotime
steelhead are the only reason erie is popular anyways


False.

 
Nahhhh, SYD.... Those 10lb eyes, 7lb Smallies, unlimited perch numbers and 30 lb carp draw no one to the area..All those boaters are just riding around the lake..  
 
Some folks are just clueless but that is just the opinion of an "OLD LOSER".....

"There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
 
 


#35
Cold
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/31 09:25:59 (permalink)
Every time this comes up you always see two predominant (read: loudmouth) points of view.
 
1. Uninformed muperes who are POed because they have to reel in at the wall for boats in September.
 
2. Boaters who don't fish for steelhead, POed because they have to buy a stamp when they're already spending so much on their boat.
 
Seems like both sides of this, while equally annoying, feel that they have valid points, the solution of which is not necessarily mutually exclusive.  If the majority of anglers fall into only one or the other of the trib/boat demographics, then let's split up the stamps.  How would that play out if there were two Erie stamps.  
 
Instead of ~$10 for a combined Erie stamp, if you wanted to, you could buy a Trib-only stamp, for $7, that would allow you to fish any waters flowing into Lake Erie, and wade at the mouth of any trib.  This would also allow for wading and shore anglers in PI bay.
 
There would be a completely separate stamp (and fund account) for boating anglers, which would also be $7, and would allow the person to fish from their boat in Lake Erie, PI Bay, and the relevant lagoons etc. in the bay.  This would not extend to angling outside the boat, and would be required for all adult anglers on the boat, not just the owner.
 
My prediction, in this situation, would be that slightly fewer steelhead would be stocked by the state (5-15% reduction) and most anglers would not notice a difference on the stream.  Easements & stream access would remain about the same.  And in the short term, stream-only anglers would be glad to save a few bucks on their stamp.
 
In contrast, I think the boat-only anglers would still be complaining, as the income available for operating the marina facilities would be significantly cut, possibly resulting in closed marinas, reduced capacity, facilities down for long-term repairs, and worse conditions of facilities as they aged, without the funding from the shore anglers.  I think the quality of their fishing, however, would remain unchanged, or improve slightly.  I think you'd also hear lots of complaining about the stamp when they couldn't get their buddies to split costs and go out with them because they didn't want to buy another stamp that they'd only use 1-2 times to go with the boat owner.
 
This is all speculation of course, and while I can see the boat-only anglers' reasons for complaining, overall, I think they do okay in the whole fund-distribution thing...it's just that the funds being spent on them are less impressive on paper and are expenses that are a far more economical (if indirect) investment than fish stocking.
#36
deetz4352
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/31 10:10:53 (permalink)
Valid and reasonable points Cold. But is it absolutely possible to please everyone , I say NO , and those who are complaining about it now may get what they want. Unfortunately that will open up a different can of problems and the other side of the argument will be displeased with the " rules" change. I see it as a conflict of interest.
 
Not all anglers are diversified in fishing for many different species of fish and different bodies of water and therefor have , lets say , a one tract mind. They choose not to fish for all species available and are not willing to oblige by one set of rules and fees for the license. To each their own but there are rules to follow , you dont have to like them , and if you choose to ignore them , you better be prepared to face the fines " if " you are caught breaking them. 
 
Ill do what I have to do in order to keep fishing. Its apart of my life and I enjoy it thoroughly. Its my release from the everyday monotony of my life. It helps me cope and relaxes me so I can continue on the road to being happy. So whatever fees/costs there are Im going to pay them so I can continue to enjoy the privileged of fishing.

The Deetz
Fishermen are born honest,but they get over it
#37
Cold
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/31 10:29:16 (permalink)
Oh I completely agree, Deetz.  I was just taking their line of reasoning out to what I felt was the most likely/logical conclusion, and showing that it still wouldn't be perfect and there would still be b!+ching and complaining, and that the loudest current complainers would likely still be the loudest complainers. 
#38
andyd8403
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/31 12:03:07 (permalink)
spoonchucker

You guys, and East End ( who SHOULD know better ) are confusing the original stamp with the current one. The original was indeed established to recompense commercial fishermen. THAT stamp expired, and there was NO lake Erie stamp for several years.After "paying off" the commercial fishermen, there were execess monies remaining from the original stamp. The language of the legislation creating the original stamp only allowed for those revenues to be spent on compensating commercial fishermen. So once that had been dione, the remaining monies layed idle ( unspent ) for many years. As they were no longer needed for their original pupose, and could not legally be spent anywhere else, or ON anything else. The legislature recently acted ) they are the only ones who could do it ) to adress that issue. It is those remaining monies ( from the original stamp ) that might be under the control of the LEAC and being spent elsewhere. NOT revenues generated by the current stamp.

The current stamp was established, and subsequently re-authorized through seperate legislation for the purpose of access in the Erie watershed ( IE: easements, etc. ). It's revenues are not being, can not be spent outside of that watershed. They also are uinder the control of the PF&BC, not the LEAC or ANY other group or organization. The terms under which current stamp monies, are also strict. This is what limits expenditures which benefit the boat angling community. And what has ( understandabley ) put the sand in their vaginas.

The petition is miguided, in that the issues raised are not relevant to the current stamp. Also because the current stamp, like the original was created through a legislative act. It can only be "abolished", by such. NOT by the governor, the PF&BC, OR through petition.  The current stamp has been very benificial, though mostly to stream anglers. It HAS benifitted lake anglers as well, with monies going toward the acquisition of the Avonia beach property, and the construction of a 300ft. fishing platform in the bay.  For boaters, not so much. Rather than try to get the stamp abolished. Those who have an issue with how revenues are spent, should work to have the legislature amend the law to relax the restrictions, or possibley exempt boat anglers.  THEY ( the legislature ) are the only ones that can do it.


Spoonchucker,
Where are you getting the information about the original and the new stamps.  I have tried to find it via searching the internet to no avail.  Could you please post a link or some supporting documentation.  Not that I do not trust your word... but I like to look at the source.

The worst day fishing is better than any day of work
#39
woodnickle
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/31 14:30:30 (permalink)
Citizen Wants Fishing Surcharge Revoked yourerie.com/fulltext?nxd_id=282022
2 days ago – At a Sons of Lake Erie meeting last night, Richard Weber talked about eliminating the Lake Erie stamp on Pennsylvania fishing licenses.

#40
slabdaddy
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/31 15:00:44 (permalink)
Kinda seems like a small price to pay for a year's worth of access to one of the greatest fisheries in the world.

“If you're in trouble, or hurt or in need - go to the poor people. They're the only ones that'll help - the only ones.”
John Steinbeck, The Grapes of Wrath
#41
bulldog1
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/01/31 15:33:50 (permalink)
Any change will only increase cost to everyone and nothing else will change...

Curiosity killed the cat, but for awhile I was a suspect.
#42
Ironhed
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/01 17:24:30 (permalink)
anadromous

I bought a five year combo. I used to spend more at the bar in one night.


 
^+1
 
 
Ironhed

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#43
fisherofmen376
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/01 17:46:55 (permalink)
It really is insane that people are complaining about 5 to 10 bucks once per year.  There are a few (almost everything else) more important issues in the world that merit attention.  This is loco!

"Come, follow me," Jesus said, "and I will make you fishers of men."
Matthew 4:19
#44
BloodyHand
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/01 23:13:23 (permalink)
bingsbaits

mohawksyd

jimmytwotime
steelhead are the only reason erie is popular anyways


False.


Nahhhh, SYD.... Those 10lb eyes, 7lb Smallies, unlimited perch numbers and 30 lb carp draw no one to the area..All those boaters are just riding around the lake..  

Some folks are just clueless but that is just the opinion of an "OLD LOSER".....

I know, they follow me around the lake. The botes r there, cuz the botes r there.
 
BH
#45
Cold
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/02 09:50:15 (permalink)
anadromous

I bought a five year combo. I used to spend more at the bar in one night.


I bought a 1 year.  The multi-year savings weren't nearly enough for me to justify giving those boneheads money now to fish in 2018.
#46
World Famous
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/02 10:49:43 (permalink)
Alot of whinning for a few dollars. As stated, the price of 2 good drinks...WF...+1 on Cold post.If the price goes up, they could use my money down the road.
#47
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/02 14:12:49 (permalink)
More perspective:  It costs $180 or something like that to play the nicest public golf course in western pennsylvania, Bedford Springs.  Thats for a four hour, 18 hole round of golf.  Pebble Beach, arguably the best public course in the USA, costs over $525. 

So relatively speaking, spending a crisp $20 at lake erie is a relative bargain.
#48
slabdaddy
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/02 15:55:42 (permalink)
Accountant

More perspective:  It costs $180 or something like that to play the nicest public golf course in western pennsylvania, Bedford Springs.  Thats for a four hour, 18 hole round of golf.  Pebble Beach, arguably the best public course in the USA, costs over $525. 

So relatively speaking, spending a crisp $20 at lake erie is a relative bargain.


OMG! I can't believe people do that! That's insane! I have paid less than that for CARS!
 
Like I said, a year's worth of fishing for less than $40. I can't take my wife out to eat for less than that.

“If you're in trouble, or hurt or in need - go to the poor people. They're the only ones that'll help - the only ones.”
John Steinbeck, The Grapes of Wrath
#49
Mr.Slickfish
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/02 16:04:49 (permalink)
Get a sMalR wife.
 

I don't always snag fish, but when I do...
I choose Little Cleos

I'm the best looking smartest snagging poacher alive...
#50
slabdaddy
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/02 20:08:01 (permalink)
The wife is small. LOL. It's me that's not so small. I meant $40 for the both of us. LOL. You knew what I meant, ya knuckleheads
 
We only eat out about twice a year. Instead I cook for her at home. Tonight I made my famous meatloaf and home made mac n cheese. You can't buy food that good at a restaurant.

“If you're in trouble, or hurt or in need - go to the poor people. They're the only ones that'll help - the only ones.”
John Steinbeck, The Grapes of Wrath
#51
deetz4352
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/03 12:33:11 (permalink)
slabdaddy

We only eat out about twice a year. Instead I cook for her at home. Tonight I made my famous meatloaf and home made mac n cheese. You can't buy food that good at a restaurant.

 
Im in the same boat as you Slabby......Id prefer to cook better food at home than eat out as well. Plus you can make the same types of food for 1/2 the cost and sometimes even less. But to each their own....

The Deetz
Fishermen are born honest,but they get over it
#52
mohawksyd
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/03 16:25:53 (permalink)
I went long and bought the five-year combo.  Between the pecuniary discount now, and the probable rate increases before those five years end, I gotta figure I saved something.
 
It helped that someone gave me a gift voucher for Xmas.
 

"For the supreme test of a fisherman is not how many fish he has caught...but what he has caught when he has caught no fish." - John H. Bradley

#53
Cold
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/03 20:39:34 (permalink)
I cook for her at home. Tonight I made my famous meatloaf and home made mac n cheese

 
Yeah.  Sure.  You "cook" for her at home. 
 
Tonight you made her your..."famous meatloaf" and home made "mac" & "cheese". 
 
Right with ya there, chief.  
 
Get it!
 

 

 

 

#54
slabdaddy
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/04 08:23:23 (permalink)
Cold, lol.
 
Deetz, amen brother. I'm a darn good cook too. I taught her how to cook. I enjoy it. Plus, it's cheaper and better. I can never find a babysitter anyway. If you have to pay for 4 kids to eat as well, you better plan on pickinging up some overtime. Know what I'm sayin?
post edited by slabdaddy - 2013/02/04 08:24:28

“If you're in trouble, or hurt or in need - go to the poor people. They're the only ones that'll help - the only ones.”
John Steinbeck, The Grapes of Wrath
#55
Molson
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/04 10:46:54 (permalink)
Bedford Springs is a Bargain in comparison to other courses around the country..  If your a golfer, Pebble has to be played once in your life..  Monterey is phenominal..
#56
jarrod6585
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/15 20:55:53 (permalink)
I am all for the abolishment of this. we set back and let the worthless fish commission who does nothing  hike up our prices to fish.  All they do is line their pockets with our money. Its all a money game anymore and that is sad. All the fish commission is are a bunch of wanna be losers who never made it to get a real job. Fishing and hunting have been a way of life and survival since the beginning of time. But these little boyscout groups formed a commission to rule everything. I do not and will not ever respect these pieces of trash and hope to God they get shut down.
 
#57
Eriefisherman69
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/15 21:46:35 (permalink)
jarrod6585

I am all for the abolishment of this. we set back and let the worthless fish commission who does nothing  hike up our prices to fish.  All they do is line their pockets with our money. Its all a money game anymore and that is sad. All the fish commission is are a bunch of wanna be losers who never made it to get a real job. Fishing and hunting have been a way of life and survival since the beginning of time. But these little boyscout groups formed a commission to rule everything. I do not and will not ever respect these pieces of trash and hope to God they get shut down.
 
 
HAHA  That coming from a short order cook




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#58
wanderer
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/02/16 12:40:12 (permalink)
It probably cost more for your internet every month than a fishing licence that you could enjoy all year just go fishing and relax
#59
chasmo
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Re:LAKE STAMP PETITION 2013/03/02 19:13:22 (permalink)
As a primarily inland water resident that fished mostly for panfish or Stripers I refused to fish any waters that required a trout stamp as I had no use for trout other than to use as bait for Raystown Stripers back in the 80's & 90's. (We would buy 'em from hatcheries for bait) In '96 0r '97 I traveled to Erie for my annual walleye excursion, I was shocked to see I had to buy a stamp. After finding out it was 3 year program I paid with no reservations.
After moving away for awhile and just recently returning to take advantage of the great fisheries in Lake Erie I have no qualm what ever with paying for a Erie stamp. The improvements everywhere are plain to see if you fished the area 15 years ago and just returned. You may be to close to the area to see the changes. (Can't see the forest for the trees).
 PS, today I even buy a trout stamp in case I accidently catch a record fish.   AND I am a non-resident of PA...... I fish Ahia and PA.
 
PA has to learn from other states that allow non-residents to apply a previously purchased 1, 3 or 7 day license fee to upgrade to an annual license.
 
Does SONS accept "foreigners" ?
#60
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