Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports. 
Claypool313
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/17 19:15:57
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If you have any more questions about them fire away.w_w.
Not really. That about answers it. I bought an Encore about 8 or 9 years ago and haven't even looked at another inline since. Love the gun. Topped with a Bushnell Elite 3200 3x9. I rarely have to move the cross hairs more than 1/2" year to year sighting in. Groups right around 2" at 100 with 100 grains 777 and 200 grain TC Shockwave. I would trust it to 150 or even further, but not worth shooting at a doe at that range. Personal best is 116 yards and that's far enough for me.
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/17 20:24:31
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DarDys
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 07:56:50
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Cool. Glad to see you had a great time. Now get back up a tree. Time is running out. You only have a month left. 
The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 07:58:31
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The PGC sent out a random survey recently. One of the questions was about the length of archery season. Here we go ! 
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dpms
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 08:20:29
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Mid September to the end of January, oh my!!
My rifle is a black rifle
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 08:48:30
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ORIGINAL: DarDys
Cool. Glad to see you had a great time.
Now get back up a tree. Time is running out. You only have a month left.
I am hunting tonight. It's been like two weeks. Going thru withdraw here.
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 08:49:04
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ORIGINAL: dpms
Mid September to the end of January, oh my!!
Gonna make Shawn break his computer !
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MuskyMastr
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 08:53:31
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Leaving archery open from oct 1 till the end of muzz in january would have no appreciable effect on the harvest. Look at the data from other states. All you would be adding would be the two weeks in November and the two weeks after rifle.
At that point in Nov, those still dedicated enough to be hunting will already have thier deer. I truly believe that the harvest would be minimal. And I am anti-HR by the way.
Better too far back, than too far forward.
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DarDys
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 09:01:46
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ORIGINAL: SilverKype
ORIGINAL: DarDys
Cool. Glad to see you had a great time.
Now get back up a tree. Time is running out. You only have a month left.
I am hunting tonight. It's been like two weeks. Going thru withdraw here.
Two weeks? Two Weeks? Just think, you have over 66% of the early season to go. If you were a firearms hunter, you would have, zero.
The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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DarDys
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 09:05:01
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ORIGINAL: SilverKype
ORIGINAL: dpms
Mid September to the end of January, oh my!!
Gonna make Shawn break his computer !
Actually, I wouldn't care if archery were in year round. Just when the subject of adding ONE DAY to firearms season comes up, it would be nice if the archers would recognize what they have and what they are asking for, and either be supportive and say "yes, that is fair" or at least be quiet and not oppose it as opposed to taking the position that we got ours, we want more, and screw everyone else.
The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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MuskyMastr
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 09:08:43
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It was said before, Impact, Impact, Impact.
Better too far back, than too far forward.
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 09:34:26
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ORIGINAL: DarDys
ORIGINAL: SilverKype
ORIGINAL: dpms
Mid September to the end of January, oh my!!
Gonna make Shawn break his computer !
Actually, I wouldn't care if archery were in year round. Just when the subject of adding ONE DAY to firearms season comes up, it would be nice if the archers would recognize what they have and what they are asking for, and either be supportive and say "yes, that is fair" or at least be quiet and not oppose it as opposed to taking the position that we got ours, we want more, and screw everyone else.
When did some archer say that firearms shouldn't get an extra day but said archery should be longer? btw... one additional Sunday of firearms would like raise harvest more than 4 weeks archery.
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DarDys
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 09:45:29
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ORIGINAL: SilverKype
ORIGINAL: DarDys
ORIGINAL: SilverKype
ORIGINAL: dpms
Mid September to the end of January, oh my!!
Gonna make Shawn break his computer !
Actually, I wouldn't care if archery were in year round. Just when the subject of adding ONE DAY to firearms season comes up, it would be nice if the archers would recognize what they have and what they are asking for, and either be supportive and say "yes, that is fair" or at least be quiet and not oppose it as opposed to taking the position that we got ours, we want more, and screw everyone else.
When did some archer say that firearms shouldn't get an extra day but said archery should be longer?
btw... one additional Sunday of firearms would like raise harvest more than 4 weeks archery.
Read the forums. It was said. More than once. By more than one poster. I question the impact on Sunday of the Sunday harvest. If the seasons stay the same as they now, a high percentage of the deer that are going to be harvested in firearms season will already have been harvested. But noone will really know for sure until it happens.
The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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DarDys
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 09:49:24
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ORIGINAL: MuskyMastr
It was said before, Impact, Impact, Impact.
Yes it was said, but in many different ways. Here is the way I look at it. Since hunting is not a catch and release sport, it does have an impact every time a deer is removed from the woods. As it now stands, approximately 30% of the deer are harvested (killed, whatever) before firearms hunters (except for juniors/seniors special season) can even start to hunt. If that were you, would you consider amost a third of the deer that will ultimately be harvested not being available at all as having a low impact on your opportunities? Doubtful.
The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 10:04:57
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Your WMU archery harvest was 22% of firearms harvest last year. I didn't include muzzleloader in the total so archery harvest for your WMU is less than that. That goes for the rest of the state. You're 30% is inflated from SRA's which account for less than 1% of the size of PA. Also, your comment on firearm hunters having to wait. It should be that way. The majority of deer taken in rifle season are pushed. Not true for archery. Couldn't imagine having archery after firearms... no reason to even hunt. Just man up.. you are against archery and don't like the season. 
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DarDys
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 11:14:37
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ORIGINAL: SilverKype
Your WMU archery harvest was 22% of firearms harvest last year. I didn't include muzzleloader in the total so archery harvest for your WMU is less than that. That goes for the rest of the state. You're 30% is inflated from SRA's which account for less than 1% of the size of PA.
Also, your comment on firearm hunters having to wait. It should be that way. The majority of deer taken in rifle season are pushed. Not true for archery. Couldn't imagine having archery after firearms... no reason to even hunt.
Just man up.. you are against archery and don't like the season.
Okay, forgetting the souls in the SRA's, whatever they are, for a minute and concentrate on your 22% figure, which is almost a quarter of the harvested deer. By your statements, that is obviously insignificant to you. So let's view it another way. Taxes, etc. are removed form your paycheck before you even get a chance to use the money or even see it for that matter, correct? Sort of like the deer that are removed from the population before the firearms hunters even get a chance to see them. Of the taxes, etc. removed form your check, only about 15% are federal income taxes. Would you rather have that money available to you, keep it the way it is, or opt to have it increase to say 22% or 30%? That is what firearms hunters are facing. The obvious answer would be to have it all, but that's not my position. I don't begrudge paying my taxes as I don't begrudge archery hunters having the opportunities they do. But at some point, enough gets to be enough. If you don't feel that way, please check the box on your federal income taxes marked "donation" and increase what you pay until it reaches 22% or 30% (if you hunt in an SRA) so you can understand what it feels like to have something removed by others beofre you even get a chance. Until you do that, you are being hypocritial and sound like those that pay no federal income tax, but feel others should pay more. And, for the last time, I have no problem with archers or the season. As stated, I wouldn't mind if it were year round, I just don't like the greediness some of the archers are displaying. And we thought that flyfishers were ubersnobs that wanted more, more, more. They don't hold a candle. BTW, maybe the majority of deer in your firearms season are pushed, mine are not.
The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 11:43:46
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You know something funny. You keep talking about rifle only hunters (70%) being the majority and consider the 30% as minority. Yet, when it comes to archery harvest it's no long minor but significant. Significant or not, the archer % of the hunter population represents the same % of total deer harvest. Explain to me how that is not fair. I could see if 30% of the deer hunter population was harvesting 50% of the deer but they are not. Statewide 30% is getting 30% of the harvest and 70% is getting 70%. In the big woods, rifle hunters are actually getting more than their share as the numbers show. So maybe... it's you be selfish and wanting more. Never heard that argument from me have you ? That is because I don't concern myself with this situation because it generally is fair. Maybe it is you that wants wants wants. As for you comment about archers getting the first chance. What it is that you want since you won't pick up a bow and put forth the effort? The opportunity is there..always has been. I read your about two lines of your tax comment and stopped. Terrible analogy for deer hunting. What do you want ? First chance with a rifle ? A concurrent hunting season for all sporting arms ? A 6 week rifle season followed by a two week archery season ? When I was with you at your spot, you showed me where the deer generally come from and I asked why you didn't hunt there. You said other people hunted there. You asked me where I would hunt if it were my area. I said up in the laurel. You said a guy already hunts there. Are you "sure" your deer aren't pushed. Also, you said a total of one guy archery hunts your area. Do 30% of your deer get whacked with a bow ?
post edited by SilverKype - 2011/10/18 11:44:31
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 11:46:46
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ORIGINAL: DarDys
ORIGINAL: SilverKype
Your WMU archery harvest was 22% of firearms harvest last year. I didn't include muzzleloader in the total so archery harvest for your WMU is less than that. That goes for the rest of the state. You're 30% is inflated from SRA's which account for less than 1% of the size of PA.
Also, your comment on firearm hunters having to wait. It should be that way. The majority of deer taken in rifle season are pushed. Not true for archery. Couldn't imagine having archery after firearms... no reason to even hunt.
Just man up.. you are against archery and don't like the season.
 But at some point, enough gets to be enough. If you don't feel that way, please check the box on your federal income taxes marked "donation" and increase what you pay until it reaches 22% or 30% (if you hunt in an SRA) so you can understand what it feels like to have something removed by others beofre you even get a chance. I took the time to read your tax comment now. You got a chance Shawn ! You always have. It's your choice. Quit beotchin' about the choices YOU are making !
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 11:48:21
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Are you gonna start beothin' about steelhead trib fishing because the lake guys have first shot ?  Get a boat.
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S-10
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 11:59:02
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DarDys---I got lost on this one. Exactly why do you feel archery hunters are greedy. If it's the Sunday hunting thing archers are losing more days than gun hunters PLUS most archers are also gun hunters AND 70% of them would benefit from the Sunday's in gun season. It won't matter how many days you have to hunt if there is nothing left to hunt.
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DarDys
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 13:08:53
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Here's the tax analogy in a nutshell.
Probably, right now, you don't get to take home 100% of what you make. You probably take home about 70%. Are you happy about that? More than likley not. You more than likely would like to take home more of the total. That is where firearms hunters now sit.
And now, when the firearms guys ask for one more day, there are archers on here saying, "oh no, that will wipe out the deer" (which we all know won't happen because allocations dictate the population) or "okay, but only as long as it doesn't cut into archery season" (I-got-mone-screw-you and we all know which it won't, it will add to it) or "oh no, but add another month to archery season (I-got-mine-screw-you-and-I-want-more)." No, that's not greedy.
If you would be paying attention instead of trying to mark me as anti-archery, you would clearly see what I want -- I want archers to say "hey, you know what, it would only be fair that if we get to almost double our season that it would be fair for firearms hunters to have an extra day, a Sunday, as well." Pretty simple. Nothing radical. Just understand that you have it good, it is going to get better, and to help a fellow hunter out.
The poster formally known as Duncsdad Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
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MuskyMastr
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 13:48:15
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Here is my real easy take on it. 30% (your number) divided by 36 days of archery season = .8 % of the total harvest per day of the season.
70% divided by 12 days = 5.8% of the total harvest per day of the season.
So adding a day to which season has a lower impact on the deer herd?
Better too far back, than too far forward.
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SilverKype
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 14:14:30
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ORIGINAL: DarDys
Here's the tax analogy in a nutshell.
Probably, right now, you don't get to take home 100% of what you make. You probably take home about 70%. Are you happy about that? More than likley not. You more than likely would like to take home more of the total. That is where firearms hunters now sit.Â
And now, when the firearms guys ask for one more day, there are archers on here saying, "oh no, that will wipe out the deer" (which we all know won't happen because allocations dictate the population) or "okay, but only as long as it doesn't cut into archery season" (I-got-mone-screw-you and we all know which it won't, it will add to it) or "oh no, but add another month to archery season (I-got-mine-screw-you-and-I-want-more)."Â No, that's not greedy.
If you would be paying attention instead of trying to mark me as anti-archery, you would clearly see what I want -- I want archers to say "hey, you know what, it would only be fair that if we get to almost double our season that it would be fair for firearms hunters to have an extra day, a Sunday, as well." Pretty simple. Nothing radical. Just understand that you have it good, it is going to get better, and to help a fellow hunter out.
The tax analogy doesn't fit the bill. I get 70% of my money now. I don't have the opportunity to get that other 30%. In the case of you having the opportunity to archery hunt, you do. So... we get 70% opportunity in taxes yet 100% opportunity to hunt all seasons. Can't see how you think taxes are a good analogy. I can see clearly and am paying attention. I did see the comments. Infact, I don't recall making any comments on Sunday hunting or an extra day of rifle. I stay out of the SH arguments because both sides have points. One side is the big picture which is valid and the other side is the details, which also has validity. But, if you want my opinion on shortening seasons.. no season should be shortened to cater to another group. If that other group fits in more time without altering other seasons, then so be it. If it does alter other seasons, it (the new season) should be removed. Is that selfish ? First come first serve. What you continually have failed to recognize and/or ignore is the difference between the difficulty of killing a deer with a bow versus a rifle. What you continue to spout out about, is that archers get more time than rifle hunters. Well no **** sherlock. How can you possibly justify length of season without taking into account the abilities (or lack there of) of what arm is being used ! If you don't understand, perhaps you should take the time to do both, so you see the differences. btw.. compared to the other states, PA archery season doesn't not have it good. We got one of the shortest seasons in the nation. Why ? Because we have alot of hunters using high powered rifles. Many states don't have either. Perhaps because rifle hunters take 75%-80% of the kill in two weeks in 99% of the available land in the state (excluding SRA), the archers and muzzleloader guys should be pushing for LESS rifle time ? Why do 70% of the hunting population kill more than 70% ? This is a double edged sword. Just about time for me to attempt to take another one of those deer before rifle hunters get a "chance."
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 14:15:08
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I don't understand what all the whining is about. The archer can now hunt from Oct ( some areas September) to the end of January. Once firearms comes in nobody says the archer has to hang up the bow. If you like archery better than gun by all means take your bow.
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S-10
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/18 16:05:26
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I think you will see more archers and more opportunities for archers in the future. The PGC is pushing for archey to be taught in the schools as a way to increase interest. One of the few things they are doing that might help in my opinion.
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World Famous
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/23 11:28:40
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Another one bites the dust...WF
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woodnickle
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/24 11:33:43
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No inline used, last deer in 2g: 
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MuskyMastr
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/24 14:04:07
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Better too far back, than too far forward.
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Noplacelikehome
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/24 14:25:46
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fishin coyote
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RE: Early Muzzle Loader Season Reports.
2011/10/24 14:49:20
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Nothing is Free!! Reward equals Effort
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