BLUE CATFISH IN PA RIVERS

Just recently read the fish & boat 3 rivers management plan that was just released the other day. Found it interesting in the list of species that were extirpated from within the 3 rivers within Pa, that BLUE CATFISH was included! I had no idea they had been native here previously!

Why dont we restore this magnificent species to its original home range! Can you imagine fighting those beasts right here in Pa??

According to the American Fisheries Society, the last blue catfish reported from the Mon River was taken in 1886. As i understand it, market fishing over exploitation did them in.

Id say even the staunchest environmentalists wouldnt have a problem with restoring a native to the ecosystem that should have been there all along? And any fisherman that wouldnt want to catch blue cats has no blood in their veins! They get huge and are one of if not thee hardest fighting fish in fresh water. Wouldnt cost much for Pa fish & boat as catfish fingerlings compared to many other species are inexpensive and/or easy to raise.

I dont see why it couldnt be realistic, anyone who would be interested should contact fish & boat and offer the suggestion also. Man that sure would be a great opportunity and also putting things right as they should have been anyway.

Me to Snag, trout are great bait for early flats,cut or live. As far as the reintroduction of blues to pa, us catfishermen wont ever be catered to like most of the trout and bass fisherman. If we want to catch blues we're goin to have to go elsewhere, them blues will eat all of pa's money fish

Here is alink to the 3 river management plans and also a link to contact them at the bottom of page

3 rivers management & contact

My comment has been submitted – basically I said that I support stocking to reestablish native species over nonnative species and would gladly support those efforts.

Good question. First guess i would have at answering that is that they arent native to most of those Pa lakes and rivers and many feel because of that they do not belong there. But thats not an issue with the area we are talking about because it IS part of their original native range within rivers of southwestern pa. In this case its a regional thing.

Only reason im guessing as to why they havent been stocked there to repopulate, is that it simply hasnt been made a priority because they have been gone from the system for such long time it hasnt really been given much thought. Also a few decades back the rivers in question were in much worse shape.

Cant think of any good reasons why they havent been, or shouldnt be in the future.

Speaking for myself, before i found that we were within the original native range and they were extirpated due to market fishing etc., id always thought we were just a tad too far north for them to thrive and thats why we didnt have them... Possibly issues with breeding or whatever. Now ive learned thats not the case.

Pay lakes stock them, possibly in a few private lakes...only place in Pa where you can currently catch one other than some unauthorized release or two here or there maybe.

Cant think of any different extreme needs that wouldnt exist habitatwise for blue cats, i dont see any reason why the habitat would be inadequate. They live in varieties of rivers, both dammed and free flowing, lakes, and reservoirs all across their range with a wide variety of conditions from strong current, to no current. Varying degrees of structure. etc. etc. Diets pretty similar to channels in general, and although they utilize cover to some extent,they are more "open water" oriented then channels and certainly moreso then flathead.

I dont know that viable numbers would be able to navigate all the locks and dams to have a large enough breeding population, and if relatively few have made the journey but not viable breeding numbers, then for all intense purposes they dont exist. Cinci as the crow flies is hardly a hop skip and a jump, and its much further as the river flows.

Apparently West Virginia didnt have them in their stretch of the ohio well upriver of Cinci. Yet they chose in 2005 to start a fingerling stocking program that was to be a 5 year program. So i think that tells us their biologists believed even though they didnt have a viable population and they were even closer to existing populations down river, they believed they had the habitat.

In Ohio not too long ago there were few in state waters and the ohio river, so few they were a protected species. They have ongoing stocking programs for Dillon Reservoir and maybe others. Apparently they are doing well in their lakes that are about the same latitude north as us. Only understandable i guess since previously many moons ago they lived here as well.


Ohio has the right idea here; blue catfish stocking

Wayne, you said they were basically gone after the late 1800s... wonder if any correlation in their disappearing and the increase in pollution during the same time period? If Pittsburgh area is the upper edge of their range already due to water temps/winter mortalities then maybe lowering the water quality was all it took to do in the breeding and ability to survive the commercial fishing pressure.

Donno. Cant really speculate on that. I know they were exploited and sold in markets in Pittsburgh area. Catfish were a delicacy back in those days. Blue cats being a big water fish, and mainly within the main river would be easier to overexploit then say channel cat which were in the river and also many miles up most of the many tribs.

Lots of resources were overexploited around that time period. Our deer herd was devastated so bad it had to be restocked. Our forests were raped at an unsustainable rate. Etc. Blue cats were just one more resource that became victim of no proper management. Cant quantify all contributing factors though.

"It would be wonderful to see them back, even if they don't achieve the awesome size they do in the southern rivers. We have caught many in the Rappahanock and Potomac Rivers and they are great fun.
So overall, I would be glad to see the reintroduction of them, as long as their are no issues with water quality or forage base for their survival."

Not written in stone, but I really dont believe that water quality would be an issue when many other species that are less tolerant are thriving. As for forage, i have no doubt at all about that. Speaking for the Upper Mon. we have PLENTY to go 'round. The shad numbers are immense and the emerald shiners most years border on the obscene. And thats without getting into all the other numerous secondary potential forage species, which are quite a few.

Thanks for posting the subject! Great to think that such a great catch could again be found in Pa waters!

Glad to see interest. Not sure how realistic PFBC taking actions would be. But certainly at least worthy of discussions id imagine.

i think it would b great to fish for bluecats in are area rivers to answer one of the questions i saw in the thread i dont think u can put big blue cats in smaller rivers and lakes in r area for atleast 1 reason that they would totally destroy a lake in the sense of eating everything and the other species would definatly suffer. and they are native to are lakes and shouldnt b messed with. but i would b really surprised to see them stock these rivers with blue cats when they cant evin stock a third of the lakes with catfish that they used to stock.twin lakes in greensburg is a prime xample of this the lake used to be full of nice cats now its full of carp and small bullhead. but i am all for it if it would work.

Catfishkid, They are mainly, like a musky, flathead, striped bass etc, a big water fish. A fish mainly for reservoirs large rivers and big lakes. Although they have been stocked in paylakes around here and do quite well. I dont believe they would reproduce there, but thats not the purpose for paylakes anyway.

Dnymph, i dont think there is any water in Pa that has them, other than maybe a few caught at a paylake or something and thrown into one of the rivers or lakes. Never know if some club got permission to stock and it wasnt announced, but im thinking it wouldve probably been made known, as it would be a fairly big deal having blues reintroduced or introduced into systems outside of private owned lakes or ponds.

If you are talking about pfbc, Not likely. They realize there would be public support for it, and the cost wouldnt be prohibitive. If it didnt work, which there isnt alot of reason to believe it wouldnt, there would be no major loss.

It may be possible that some unapproved stocking by individuals or club could take place i guess. But probably small scale. I havent heard any rumors in the area through the rumor mill, and would chalk up the yough blue cat stockings as rumor and nothing more until someone could substantiate it for sure with first hand knowledge of.

Anyway, i dont know if blues where native to the yough, but do know they were to the Monongahela and no would love to see them return.

Very few fish would get to 60 lb. They are fairly rare even further south, let alone this far north. And there is plenty of room to roam and plenty of prey species so as there is no need for them to "decimate" the smallmouths & sauger. Other species do quite well in the presence of blue catfish, as some of the best bass lakes and rivers in the nation are absolutely polluted with both blues and flathead.

A flatheads mouth is MUCH larger than a blue catfish and a 30 lb flathead could probably eat as large or larger a fish than a 50 lb blue. And the flatheads havent wiped out all the other species where they are native, and the prey base according to biology reports on the mon show the forage base is very very abundant. Of course they didnt need to tell any of us that spend much time on the mon. The shad, shiners, suckers etc. are plentiful.

The blues were native to the range. There is no reason they shouldnt be put back since they belong there. The fact they provide another great recreational opportunity on top of that is just all the better. And a great opportunity to grow the "big game" fishery of the mon.

Btw, in winter, they go to the deeper holes to overwinter,of which there are plenty on the mon.

I think the one thing you are looking into too much is seeing where they are native to.I enjoy carp fishing and they were stocked in the late 1800's and people always say they are non native to most waters. After doing a lot of research you will find a good majority of all types of fish that we enjoy are non native to the waters they are in. The key difference is the ones that make people money such as smallmouth bass are never frowned upon for being non native fish. Money talks when it comes to things like this.

I would imagine that this could be a good possibility. The only thing I have a question on is how long till they reach maturity of say a 50lb fish. The way people overharvest do you think they wuold make it to that weight considering how many larger fish go unreleased?

Yes you are correct, Blues and steelhead were both stocked in West Newton some years back. The cats were stocked later in the season. Steelhead were only tried once if i remember correctly, but the cats were stocked on more than one occasion. My Uncle called them Alabama blue cats they were 24 plus inches when put in.

ORIGINAL: wayne c

Just as an update, Had recieved word on this, that it is something that might be considered, and that there has been a level of interest expressed by some area anglers to pfbc.

If anyone would be interested in seeing this happen, please submit your comments here:


SUBMIT COMMENTS HERE

just submitted my comments thanks for the link wayne!!!. i belong to a pittsburgh catfish fourm and will post the link up there. even if nothing happens atleast we can say we tried!! thanks again and tight lines justin.

Perry two. Sportsmen club also stocked blue cats years ago.haven't heard of anyone catching them though.they put in some from 28"-33"