First Intruder

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flyfisherman22
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2011/12/11 21:10:52 (permalink)

First Intruder

I wanted to post some pictures of my first intruder tie for steelhead.

I wanted to see what you all thought. I know there are somethings wrong with it even to me looking at it when i completed it:

Looks like the fly has a little to much bulk
Seems congested on a streamer hook (looking into buying waddington shanks now)
Size 6 octopus hook seems a little small and possibly not extended off shank far enough
Front hook isnt clipped off yet didnt have and snips with me tonight
I like the look of the ostrich herl when its spun, but i cannot for the life of me get the ostrich herl to come out decent. it just goes anyway it wants, and even when i try to go slow and pull the strands as they wrap, it just doesnt come out very neat.

Also, What do you all recommend line wise for attaching the stinger hook to the shank, and how exactly to you thread it?

But any suggestions would be appreciated



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post edited by flyfisherman22 - 2011/12/11 21:22:21

For the supreme test of a fisherman is not how many fish he has caught, not even how he has caught them, but what he has caught when he has caught no fish."
~ John H. Bradley
#1

23 Replies Related Threads

    LoganWade03
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/11 21:30:42 (permalink)
    Looks good, will definitely catch fish.  They will get better the more you tie and get use to the materials.

    The moment of truth. Where all other things unconsciously melt away from our minds the instant a fish takes our fly. We stand there on the water with wide eyes, caught in a battle stance with an idea of confidence and hope
    #2
    swinger
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/12 19:10:18 (permalink)
    fly looks good to me. I get what you are saying with the compressed body. What you may want to try is getting rid of the eyes. Extend the body some and use a conehead for a prop. Now use your ostrich and collar in front of the cone. I use a plastic bead as a bump on some of my patterns. On page 2 of the steelhead flies thread I used that method in my org/pink intruder. Using tubes I still have plenty of room for eyes but with limited shank size u could loose the eyes but still have the weight in the cone. Just an idea. As for what line to use on your stinger. Many use fireline but I use power pro because that is what I have on hand. I have even used fly backing. I used waddington shanks for awhile. I like the weight they give but dislike the price of them. I went with tubes because they are less expensive. I really like the HMH tubes. If you have any questions shoot me a pm. Hope I helped.

    Quality over quantity

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    #3
    HCsteel
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/12 21:28:38 (permalink)
    For joining line/material I use braid(fireline 30lb) or Rio's Wire leader material. If you do not want to pay so much for waddingtons check out the new shanks that are available from the people that make Fish Skulls. There is also the option of going to tubes which may be the cheapest investment overall. You do not have to spin the ostrich, you can just place it where you want and then wrap it on, this is what I usually do with my rhea. It also doesn't look like you have anything behind the herl to keep it propped open, look at putting some bucktail before you put the herl on or maybe spin an artic fox dubbing loop to prop it open.
    #4
    D-nymph
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/13 09:54:09 (permalink)
    I just use the cheapest salmon fly hooks I can find for the shank. And clip the front hook off with wire cutters after the fly is tied.
    #5
    Plum Bob
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/16 07:13:31 (permalink)
    On the spey pages tying forum "Wild Bill" posted a couple really cool looking intruder patterns, tied sparse, worth checking out maybe for ideas, variations of what you guys are tying now. For me, I'll stick with the tubes, tying up a bunch of artic fox/finn racoon scandi style now.
    #6
    flyfisherman22
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/16 18:50:12 (permalink)
    Swinger, Ya i know what your saying, i know with the stinger line, i used 25lb amnesia but i couldnt per say "thread" it like ive seen people do, i just had to loop it through, and when i look at the pictures of everyone elses, they are doubled through and then around the hook. the amnesia wouldnt double through thats where i had the issue, but ill see what i can dig up to fix that issue..

    HCsteel, i just ordered the fish skull shanks i believe it was right after i posted this, they are the cheapest that i found, and as for the tubes, i may give those a try after i finish up all the shanks i have now. I did use bucktail behind the herl, but as i figured out, i need to add a little more to keep the herl up vs laying back so much.


    For the supreme test of a fisherman is not how many fish he has caught, not even how he has caught them, but what he has caught when he has caught no fish."
    ~ John H. Bradley
    #7
    bingsbaits
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/18 20:49:32 (permalink)
    Tried a couple Intruder types myself.
    Just couldn't get Swinger out of my head with the marabou so that was what I used.


    Few less wraps of Bou on this one probaly couldn't hurt.




    Thought the Smallies might like this one.


    "There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
     
     


    #8
    KJH807
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/18 23:00:42 (permalink)
    I am a fan of complex ties
    but they are more for me than the fish

    look good bings
    clip that hook and throw some eyes on there and you are good to go


    FF22
    think of building your fly with the stiffest materials under the soft
    those will fish... but will pin out



    #9
    bingsbaits
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/21 18:23:09 (permalink)
    A question and a newbie lesson.

    To get the marabou to stand out I wrapped about 3 wraps of stiff neck hackle of the same color, Can you make them look too poofy ? Or will the bou just flow together when wet ?


    Newb lesson #1. When brushing back the marabou to see how pretty it looks "Don't forget about the trailer hook hidden in there."

    "There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
     
     


    #10
    steely34
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/21 18:46:42 (permalink)
    At some point I gotta get back into trying this - when I get done with everything else. Once again - a whole different style of tyin. Love it! And I can remember relating to lesson # 1 Bings.

    "They say you forget your troubles on a trout stream, but that's not quite it..... you begin to see where your troubles fit into the grand scheme of things, and suddenly they're just not such a big deal anymore."

    John Gierach

    #11
    Plum Bob
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/21 18:59:19 (permalink)
    "Can you make them look too poofy?"

    Intruders are for poofs. Real men fish scandi tubes like the vikings do. Haha, sorry, just couldn't resist. You're flies look good Bings. Based on what little I know about this style of fly, hackle, hair in dubbing loops (arctic fox, etc.), dubbing balls, chenille balls can all be used to get more flair and profile to your fly. I don't like the intruder style fly tied on a shank because of the droop, hang down of the hook. I know they are fish catchers and quite popular. The same thing can be tied on a front weighted tube which would greatly reduce or eliminate the hook hang down.
    post edited by Plum Bob - 2011/12/21 19:02:46
    #12
    swinger
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/21 19:41:03 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: bingsbaits

    A question and a newbie lesson.

    To get the marabou to stand out I wrapped about 3 wraps of stiff neck hackle of the same color, Can you make them look too poofy ? Or will the bou just flow together when wet ?


    Newb lesson #1. When brushing back the marabou to see how pretty it looks "Don't forget about the trailer hook hidden in there."



    I love the poof. Many of my flies are based on the poof. I use different materials to achieve poof. Dubbing, chennile, beads, polar chennile, hackle, rumps hackle, deer,fox, and my latest play is craft fur. Its all the rage in my circle right now. Another poof gainer is tying in reverse. I really dig that method. The most important thing in building poof is to build patforms for the larger material to rest upon. For Example. Stage 1 would be a dubbing ball. IMO it also can double as a target in the rear of the fly. Dont get skimpy with the ball. Gob it on. Step 2 Spun arctic fox. Get rid of most of the under fur and put in dubbing loop. It will flow back but wont collapse because of the dubbing ball support. That support just dubbled in size for your last and softest material. Step 3 Soft material. With all that support even the softest marabou wont collapse. It is propped up from the first 2 steps. Now that is just a basic example. You cn keep propping and propping and get as big as you want. But remember that the more material you add the more water that fly will hold. Who wants to chuck a water logged rat all day? Not me. Hope it cleared some things up for those who dont understand how we achieve poofieness.

    Quality over quantity

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    I>U

    JC Rules!!!!!!!
    #13
    bingsbaits
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/21 19:45:38 (permalink)
    Thanks gents answered my question.

    "There is a pleasure in Angling that no one knows but the Angler himself". WB
     
     


    #14
    D-nymph
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/22 09:36:02 (permalink)

    ORIGINAL: Plum Bob

    I don't like the intruder style fly tied on a shank because of the droop, hang down of the hook. I know they are fish catchers and quite popular. The same thing can be tied on a front weighted tube which would greatly reduce or eliminate the hook hang down.


    If you use a stiff material like 50lb power pro instead of a limp material like spider wire or backing, the hang down effect is eliminated. Or at the least vastly minimized. Using a shorter tether to the trailer hook helps this too.

    Not that it makes a difference for me, as I still fish a good bit, but don't catch fish any more.
    #15
    Rickerd
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    First Intruder 2011/12/22 14:16:08 (permalink)
    FF22,
    I like your pattern and color choices. You've gotten alot of good advice from these guys. I've fished similar patterns in OH streams for 3 seasons now. I prefer using braid on the trailer hook even though it may hang down. I think it sets into the corner of their mouth better and holds on. I only fish them with sink tip lines now and I don't lose as many flies as I would with floating tip. I can control the depth much better. These big flies bring out the players and trying to keep the fly between 6-12 inches off the bottom will bring up the fish. When the maribou gets wet, it will thin out the profile, but, under water it will undulate in the current. I was in Eugene, OR recently and bought a handful of intruders from a fly shop. A couple were more sparse than yours but some were the same. I have had good luck with them tied thick in slightly stained water, and I use them more sparse as the water clears. I have also tied a few with a sucker spawn in angora on the trailer fly, which acts as a target. The angora also may hold better before I set the hook. I tie in a few turns of maribou with the angora, and it will look like a tail of a baitfish in the current. Also, when fish are active, try fishing them upstream along a seam with short jerks of the rodtip. This imitates a fleeing baitfish and will somedays catch as many upstream as downstream. Just hold on to your rod. Seriously.
     
    Feel free to send me all the ones you don't like. I will give them a try and let you know how they work.
     
    Best regards,
    Rickerd
    #16
    KJH807
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/22 15:00:35 (permalink)
    if you look at the bottom of page 2 of the steelhead flies thread you will see another riggin style
    you thread your lead and tie in the hook... then attach with a pc of junction tube
     
     



    #17
    Plum Bob
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    RE: First Intruder 2011/12/23 11:04:48 (permalink)
    Run your leader through the front eye of the shank, around the side of the fly, through the junction tubing, tie the hook on, seat the junction tubing on the shank, seat your hook in the junction tubing so it is lined up or down. Right? Sounds complicated, really simple. A good method for regions where there are restrictions on adding weight to flies, cones, dumbells, etc. such as eastern canadian atlantic salmon water.

    Fluorescent tubing, ex. Guideline/Frodin FITS, size medium is good for this an will accept a size 4 or 6 straight eye egg/tube fly hook.
    #18
    flyfisherman22
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    RE: First Intruder 2012/01/05 22:47:15 (permalink)
    Ok guys, for the past week or so ive been trying all sorts of things for the intruders, only difficulty i seem to be having now is when im wrapping (dubbing loop) the feelers on they are tending to lay back onto the shank a little to much, only material that i can get to hold them up is dyed deer hair. when using arctic fox does the dubbing ball have to be a little bit bigger than with the deer hair? or what types of materials would you recommend?

    For the supreme test of a fisherman is not how many fish he has caught, not even how he has caught them, but what he has caught when he has caught no fish."
    ~ John H. Bradley
    #19
    KJH807
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    RE: First Intruder 2012/01/05 22:57:56 (permalink)
    Nothing should be a dubbing ball
    Rather a spun and brushed loop

    The limpness of the ostrich... Which allows for great movement
    Requires a material under for loft
    A "ball" will not keep the ostrich open and off the shank

    Deer hair floats... Which is a main reason it is no longer widely used on these flies



    #20
    flyfisherman22
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    RE: First Intruder 2012/01/06 13:04:12 (permalink)
    KJ, i meant it as the chenille bump not dubbing ball, thats my bad. but what do you recommend for keeping the ostrich or rhea up and not so tight to the shank. ive done half and half and deer hair is only thing keeping it open. Could it be maybe im not using enough forward wraps of arctic fox? Maybe schlappen before and after the feelers in the front?

    For the supreme test of a fisherman is not how many fish he has caught, not even how he has caught them, but what he has caught when he has caught no fish."
    ~ John H. Bradley
    #21
    KJH807
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    RE: First Intruder 2012/01/06 14:48:28 (permalink)
    *my opinion
     
    there is no 1 material that will keep the fly open... moreso a combination of materials
    each one lofting the next
    also this will allow for more dept in the fly and a shimering effect as the top layers move showing or hiding the under materials



    #22
    KJH807
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    RE: First Intruder 2012/01/06 15:00:51 (permalink)
    Here is what i was talking about

    Dry VS wet

    y



    post edited by KJH807 - 2012/01/06 15:01:17



    #23
    flyfisherman22
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    RE: First Intruder 2012/01/06 15:21:43 (permalink)
    Thanks, I will get back on you tube and watch some being tied. one thing is for sure the bump or target in the back of mine are not nearly as big as what your first wet pic. ill ill just keeping tying to come up with something satisfactory.

    For the supreme test of a fisherman is not how many fish he has caught, not even how he has caught them, but what he has caught when he has caught no fish."
    ~ John H. Bradley
    #24
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