Like most things, it is how it is being handled. Most Americans would likely agree, government is wasteful and something should be done. Even the biggest MAGAs on here are saying “wish he would pull it back a hair and not well thought out”. Same deal with Ukraine, should we be spending close to what all of Europe is combined, probably not. Should we be berating the Ukrainian leader, calling him a dictator and claiming he started things? Where is the Trump from November that denounced the Project 2025 and talked that Europe should pick up the slack. NONE of this was what he put out there then and “people voted for”. It is turning out to be pretty close to what guys like MyWar warned of. Hopefully it is just a smoke screen, if not, you know what the Nazis did to the old and frail?

BTW, not trying to be a jerk. Imagine the “efficiency” if Medicare and SS were eliminated. Then private health insurance not covering the elderly. It will happen if left unchecked. It was part of the original plan.

Porktown
should we be spending close to what all of Europe is combined, probably not. Should we be berating the Ukrainian leader, calling him a dictator and claiming he started things? 

 
my "speculation" on that, is to brainwash those with a good working moral compass to not feel so bad  about  throwing the Ukrainian people under the bus
 
KTF 

genieman77

 
my "speculation" on that, is to brainwash those with a good working moral compass to not feel so bad  about  throwing the Ukrainian people under the bus
 
KTF 

It would take a REALLY gullible populace to fall for that, over him being a complete phony POS. But we know his base, so fits well.

Trump should be careful what he wishes for, he just might get it.  If Ukraine is overrun or otherwise collapses after the U.S. abandons it,  Trump is going to own it.  Biden never recovered after the clumsy withdrawal from Afghanistan and subsequent hand-off to the Taliban.  A Ukraine collapse would be at least equivalent in terms of public opinion.

 
  Quote: 
Porktown,
"Should we be berating the Ukrainian leader, calling him a dictator and claiming he started things?"
 
  What you talkin' 'bout Holmes? After 2 days he has dementia. Mind is fading rapidly daily. Need to quit letting these old farts run for any office. 
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnWUy0rkvhg

Irisheyeball
Trump should be careful what he wishes for, he just might get it.  If Ukraine is overrun or otherwise collapses after the U.S. abandons it,  Trump is going to own it.  Biden never recovered after the clumsy withdrawal from Afghanistan and subsequent hand-off to the Taliban.  A Ukraine collapse would be at least equivalent in terms of public opinion.

Irish it wasn't a clumsy withdrawal it was a surrender BIG difference. He also pulled out the military and left the American civilians there not to mention the billions of equipment left behind in the SURRENDER.Not to mention the American blood shed wasted lives the 2 are not closely similar. 

Irisheyeball
Trump should be careful what he wishes for, he just might get it.  If Ukraine is overrun or otherwise collapses after the U.S. abandons it,  Trump is going to own it.  Biden never recovered after the clumsy withdrawal from Afghanistan and subsequent hand-off to the Taliban.  A Ukraine collapse would be at least equivalent in terms of public opinion.

 
I'm with Ice.
It's not equivalent.
We didn't invade and occupy  Ukraine for 20 years. 
 
Most Americans that can see past the end of their nose, see there are no good solutions and continued funding only prolongs the inevitable. (Ukraine will lose the part Putin has annexed) 
 
I'll give Trump credit for having the balls to get us out of an unwinnable war in Afghanistan.
(could you imagine the outrage if Obama would have negotiated with the Taliban?!?!) 
 
As well as the balls to broker the only resolution available for Ukraine without starting WWIII 
...as awful as it may be, the unfortunate reality is, there is just not enough leverage available to force Putin  beyond us or EU putting in troops.
 
 That's how it should be presented to the American people rather than the "hate Zel/it's their fault" spin campaign
 
KTF  

Genie you are 100% correct on this.

genieman77
 
$171b is latest estimate spent.
as far as I know, it's legit 
 KTF 
 

We have Inspector Generals. Or at least we used to.
 I see where the $ disagreement is between Z's ($100B) and Trump's ($350B but actually $182B) lie in terms of $ appropriated vs $ dispersed.
It's all here in this Inspector General Report. 
https://www.ukraineoversight.gov/Funding/
 
It shows that as of December 31, 2024, $83.4B of the $182B has actually been dispursed. I'm sure more has been released since but I'm inclined to agree more with Z on that $100B 
 
 And, here's what DOD has provided as of 1/20/25
https://www.state.gov/bureau-of-political-military-affairs/releases/2025/01/u-s-security-cooperation-with-ukraine#:~:text=To%20date%2C%20we%20have%20provided,invasion%20of%20Ukraine%20in%202014.
 
 
 
 
 

The increased howling at the moon over Oval Office meeting has been fun to see. Much like Reddit, Facebook, IG, these forum TDSers think extending the war and spending more is the popular opinion. Newsflash, social media is not representative of real world…otherwise Kamala would've won the 7 swing states.

LDD cant handle fact Biden got ****ed at Zelenskyy for same thing Trump did. Swear some TDSers have memory of a goldfish.