Egg Take post

L13:
it seems it got flushed down the pooper..........
the SR area fourms here are looking low, i don't know , but it seems headed in the same direction
it does not seem the same without the old gang........
while the Eastern NY seems to be on the upswing
 
as for the stakeholders meeting:
Loren attended and gave a full report on the "other site"
 
 

Well, it wasn't me that used questionable language in the post!
 
As for trib names, they are all on any map, and if it runs into the lake, it gets fish, so I don't understand the contraversy about naming them.  Finding the access points is easy enough as well if someone wants to look at the DEC site.
 
Maybe I should just get on the "other site", but I always got the impression there were less outlaws on this one.
 
L13

HT,

What's the URL for Loren's post?  I can't find it.
 
L13

Lucky- they are not naming small tribs over there either. There is a header that says it is not welcome....
Someone started a thread over there complaining about it as well.
The theory is they are very fragile and are more apt to be devistated by over fishing.

Charlie may I suggest that if you are looking for another board with good knowledgable fishers (although like most boards primarily pinners) riverrunsrods.com is a good fit. Much smaller than SC but more like here it is mostly about the fishing and not so much the happy birthday, look at me I caught a big one, me an Joe went fishing stuff. Thats all there but it is broken down into smaller nitches that you can just ignore if you want.

Mr. Metalslayer sir may I say aaarrrr to ye matey. Don't you think 13 would be a valuable member at RRR. 

  Good luck and God bless.

I am on The Drake. Fun Place. 
The other you speak of- I haven't posted there in a while. I do not agree with snagging fish for the DEC or under any other pretense. I also think the use of Trout Eggs for bait should be banned because of people slitting, or squeezing the things for eggs and leaving the rest lay on the bank.
I didn't take the thread down because of what I said- I got tired of looking at your crying. Boo hoo.
Here's an idea-Buy a freaking map.

Happy new year!.

Back on the subject of the egg take.
1) Were none of the eggs of fish that were at the hatchery before the water temp dropped to 60 degrees used. That is to say was there absolutely 0% viability from fish in the river before Oct 17. If there was any viability wouldn't having imposed no kill regs on the whole river have allowed some more fish to have made it to the hatchery. Even if those early returning fish gave eggs of low viability any viability is better than the 0% gotten from fish in car trunks isn't it.
2) Would short bursts of increased flow (50-100cfs) at night for short time (2-4 hours) have gotten the kings to move upriver under cover of darkness when they feel more secure and when people aren't wading and standing in the shallow water they had to migrate through this year. Back in the early 80s when they had a high low water situation daily the fish would continue upriver through the riffles to the next deeper area and hold. Doing so nightly would have gotten them to the upper river where they are more spread out and not as vulnerable to angling pressure.
3) Refer back to car trunk statement!
4) Is the water from the SR pumped into the hatchery or how would adding to its flow hurt the fish already being reared. I thought the hatchery pumped water from wells that should have had a constent temp no matter what the sun warmed water of the SR was doing.
While there may have been no good SOLUTION to the problems faced this fall there were I believe ways to mitigate them and DEC didn't take them.

WB Banned? You must be joking. He adds flavor to this place in his own sick way- just like you and I.
WB- Surely if they could have gotten fish up there under darkness and pumped well water through the holding tanks one would think the eggs would develop? I have no clue. I'm not a biologist, but like you I see a 0% chance when they are all drug out.
Maybe the Browns & Steelhead will be that much bugger in a few years- and the return salmon? Would be the one good thing that came out of this past season in the eyes of many.

Guess trout-boy was right---they really are HEROES.

I didn't see any mention of thier allowing snagged fish to be kept for the egg taking. I guess the thinking is that if they don't mention it it didn't happen and it will go away. The news article called those keeping foul hooked fish galleant while it also forgot to mention that they were allowed to keep foul hooked fish for the egg collectors. Why is it against the law except when they decide to allow it. Are salmon game fish to be fished for or trash fish to be snagged. You can;'t have it both ways.
While it did say low water was the reason for low numbers of kings moving upriver it didn't didn't mention how adding water to the SR flow (yes I know the res was dramaticly low) would negatively affect the hatchery. If the hatchery gets its water from underground wellheads how does the temp of the SR affect it whether it is flowing at 100cfs or 1000cfs?

I was at the Stakeholders meeting.... DEC faced a situation according to them that they've not faced before. It had nothing to do with low water...it was all due to warm temps of the water...way longer then they have ever faced. They've never started taking eggs later then the day after Columbus day. last fall they started two weeks later, and then extended into Nov, with having to run off to the Black River, Oak Orchard, and 18 mile.
 
When they did take eggs at the hatchery....they still took them at higher temps then they have ever taken them before but decided they had no choice. Thus the way less % of viable eggs.
 
Hatchery water has no play in salmon showing up in the hatchery...the well water is for eggs and fry growing in the tanks not fish in the race ways. According to several biologists even if they had the water to dump down river, they would have done MORE damage running warm water to initiate a run of fish up stream. Makes sense to me....water at the time they wanted the fish was in the mid 60's and is essentially leathel.
 
I don't have much to say about what went on at 18 mile (I wasn't there...so can't comment) . If you ask a lake angler if they are happy the DEC did what ever they could...under the circumstances...you might get the Hero tag...on the trib side you might get another feeling. Either way they got 1.9 million eggs and hope for 1 million smolts to be planted.
 
The plan for the future if this happened again is to utilize the ladders at the Black River...it's already a good layout for egg taking. DEC did say they felt they missed their opportunity to get the eggs they neeed from the Black...and felt they could have gotten all they needed had they reacted sooner to the Black River.
 
In talking to Dr Mike from Cape Vincent...who's doing all the research on the Wild fish coming back to the SR....we'll have to start considering that if a significant number of returning adults are in fact wild fish...they may not in a high percentage ever ascend the hatchery....since they weren't born in there. This is the reason SR will get it's full alotment of stockers before anybody else gets their fish.
 
As mentioned earlier, Pen Rearing Crews are ramping up to try and get permission to raise what ever alotment (100%) they get in the pens to try and ensure good local recruitment.
 
Pretty much end of story.

I'm not so sure--my record keeping sux--but I can remember warmer water(at least down low) later than this year.