Didn't take long

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S-10
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2010/01/01 13:29:09 (permalink)

Didn't take long

Fulton County WCO Kevin A. Mountz recently stopped a vehicle for late
spotlighting. During the stop, Mountz discovered the two occupants of the
vehicle were in possession of a cocked crossbow in the back seat of their
vehicle. "There were three bolts along side of it," he said. "Two were in a
quiver and the third was lying on the floor directly beneath the crossbow.
The driver also was found to have about eight grams of suspected marijuana
along with a pipe. Criminal charges are pending verification of the
evidence at the State Police crime lab."
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    S-10
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 13:33:01 (permalink)
    For example, Montgomery County WCO Raymond Madden currently is working
    on an investigation where a 17-inch, eight-point buck weighing about 200
    pounds was poached around 10 p.m. on Oct. 14, near Swamp Pike Road and New
    Hanover Square Road. "It was shot with a crossbow, and we believe that the
    suspect attempted to take the deer from where it fell," WCO Madden said.
    "We have circumstantial evidence pointing toward a potential suspect, but
    could use any help in this case. Anyone with more information is urged to
    contact the Southeast Region Office at 610-926-3136."
    #2
    spoonchucker
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 13:48:15 (permalink)
    So, are you saying that legalizing the use of crossbows is responsible?

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    #3
    woodnickle
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 14:00:53 (permalink)
    Poachers don,t use 22,s or 222,s neither.

    #4
    DaFuNK
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 14:58:00 (permalink)
    people kill deer, not crossbows
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    S-10
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 17:13:50 (permalink)
    Can't shoot out the window with a straight bow.

    Sometimes, the Game Commission uses deer decoys.Leiendecker will set up a decoy buck just off a roadway and use a remote control to move its head.Typically, they are set up on the property of someone who has reported poaching.

    Though many people think decoys are used as a form of entrapment, Leiendecker said that's not the case.He can outfit the decoy with racks of various size and he doesn't use the largest rack possible so as not to entice someone into shooting at a trophy animal they otherwise wouldn't shoot, he said.Because of the time involved, the decoys are used only selectively.

    Once, he said, he had the decoy set up and a poacher shot at it with a crossbow.The man was so intent on shooting it, Leiendecker said, that he was unfazed when Leiendecker walked up to him in uniform as he was readying another shot.
    #6
    billw0752
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 18:51:22 (permalink)
    Why dont you blame all the road kills on the cross bow too.
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    S-10
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 19:21:32 (permalink)
    22's and 222's make noise---most poachers get caught because someone hears a shot and calls the law.
    Here's one from a year ago---even the HSUS got involved

    The Humane Society of the United States is offering a $1,000 reward for information leading to the arrest and conviction of the person or persons responsible for illegally killing a male black bear in Kidder Township, Carbon County, Pennsylvania.

    The Case:

    According to the Pennsylvania Game Commission, a black bear was found dead on September 12th next to a restaurant on Route 940. The bear was allegedly shot by a crossbow and left to die in the parking lot.
    #8
    spoonchucker
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 21:36:31 (permalink)
    So if we ban crossbows this will stop?

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    #9
    S-10
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 21:54:09 (permalink)
    We didn't have much of a problem before we started allowing their use as a hunting weapon.----

    The search yielded several piles of corn, a bucket of grease and other forms of bait. Inside the cabin, where Doyle stayed the night before, officers found two shotguns and a crossbow, Finnegan said.

    While Finnegan said he and the other officers stopped Doyle and Prout before they were able to shoot any bears over the bait, there was plenty of evidence that damage had already occurred. Finnegan said he found four gut piles from deer around the cabin and a deer carcass on a nearby hill. A search of an embankment where Finnegan said he believed Doyle discarded carcasses yielded the remains of nine other deer. Finnegan believes there may have been more.

    “In my opinion, he is (Doyle) only telling us part of the story. Hopefully, I’ll find out the rest as I continue to investigate,” Finnegan said.
    #10
    spoonchucker
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/01 22:15:51 (permalink)
    So banning them would eliminate, or reduce the problem? The "bad guys" won't have, or use them any way?
     
     

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    #11
    akitadog
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 07:36:25 (permalink)
    they are already doing something illegal. do you think they will stop using something because it is now illegal? i dout it.
    #12
    Mr.Slickfish
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 07:56:55 (permalink)
    My keybord keaps mizspeling werds.



    I don't always snag fish, but when I do...
    I choose Little Cleos

    I'm the best looking smartest snagging poacher alive...
    #13
    RELAYER
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 08:02:35 (permalink)
    How about a van with a sliding side door and a guy knelling shooting a COMPOUND might as well ban vans and compounds bows to
    #14
    S-10
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 08:35:51 (permalink)
    There were very few crossbows out there until they became legal for hunting. Many folks in this state and others warned this would happen but were ignored by the manufactures and supporters. A van with sliding doors is great for a crossbow but not so great for a straight bow unless you want to remove or replace the seat.----------

    HARRISBURG, Pa., Feb. 16 /-USNewswire/ -- A Pennsylvania Game Commission Wildlife Conservation Officer filed multiple charges against David N. Hartzell Jr., 28, of Centre Township, Perry County, for his involvement in the illegal killing of a black bear and two deer. All charges were filed with District Justice Donald F. Howell in Newport on Feb. 14.

    Following a preliminary investigation, Game Commission officers On Jan. 26, secured a search warrant and, on Jan. 26, seized from Hartzell's home wildlife parts, photographs, hunting licenses and two crossbows. Following the search, additional information was received that prompted a probe into the origin of one of the seized crossbows. Through this investigation, it was learned that the crossbow, valued at more than $1,000, was stolen from a sporting goods store near Hamburg, Berks County.

    Based on the investigation, WCO Steve Hower charged Hartzell with: one count of receiving stolen property, a first-degree misdemeanor, which carries a possible prison term of up to five years and up to $10,000 in fines; three counts of unlawful killing or taking of big game (one black bear and two deer), which carries fines of up to $1,500 for the bear and up to $800 each for each deer; one count of failure to tag and report big game, which carries fines of up to $200; and two counts of permit violations, for the unlawful possession of parts from two deer without first securing the proper
    #15
    akitadog
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 11:29:58 (permalink)
    people have been poaching deer with crossbows for years. even before they even thought about making them legal.
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    Free Spirit
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 11:48:39 (permalink)
    S-10, not only are you your own worst enemy you are one of the worst things that could ever happen to hunting. Why don't you join PETA and "help them" with your babble. Unbelievable!
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    S-10
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 12:15:15 (permalink)
    If you don't like the topic you are free to ignore it These articles and reports I posted are already on the record and not something I made up. As far as for PETA and the other anti's they aren't getting anything on here they don't already know or information they don't have. What kind of crossbow do you have?
    #18
    World Famous
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 13:09:54 (permalink)
    In a slightly different direction, allowing crossbows may be another step into banning rifles. Hear me out. In- lines will be next to have their own season. With enough special seasons and our ranks divided , is out of the realm of possibility that we will then be restricted to shotguns only? Allowing crossbows, with out special permits, has greatly increased the competion during bow season. We have shown as a group that whatever is handed out by the PAGC is just fine and dandy. By the time it comes to restrictions on rifle use it will be to late.I personally have nothing against crossbows, they have a legit place in hunting. We just must look past our noses at possible future agendas.Just my idea. BTW, I use a flintlock for 90% of my deer hunting.
    #19
    billw0752
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 13:22:27 (permalink)
    I guess we didnt have poaching before crossbows ,people dont like progress .Crossbos are not the problem  ,PEOPLE are the PROBLEM not crossbows,
    #20
    akitadog
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 13:44:27 (permalink)
    def. the people.im not against crossbows eigther. i personaly would not want to use 1 unless i have to. some people cant pull back compounds because of back problems or shoulder problems. if that is the case i dont mind people using them. you can poach with a compound just as you can with a crossbow. i look for pa. going to shot gun only in the near future, and i wont mind that eigther. more deer will survive the season.
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    takeagillpill
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 13:53:05 (permalink)
    i think the point everyone is trying to make is laws only effect law abiding citizens... poachers who arent abiding the law in the first place do not care if crossbows are legal or not. so blaming the legalization of crossbows in Pa is foolish, any law that allows more opportunities for more people to get involved in hunting or the outdoors should be celebrated.  

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    billw0752
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 14:56:01 (permalink)
    I hate to see this board if they evey allow sunday hunting ,the tissue factery wont be able to keep up.
    #23
    spoonchucker
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 15:05:49 (permalink)
    "There were very few crossbows out there until they became legal for hunting. Many folks in this state and others warned this would happen but were ignored by the manufactures and supporters."
     
    So, then banning them would eliminate, or greatly reduce their use by criminals?
     
    Do you see where I'm going? And the contradiction between your arguement against crossbows, and previous arguement for other classes of weapons? Remember, how "the criminals" will still have, and use them?

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    #24
    S-10
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 15:27:18 (permalink)
    Not a counterdiction at all Spoon-- Many who were against it in the beginning (in most states) stated that allowing them for hunting would open the floodgates to increased manufacturing which would result in many more being easily available. Before they started allowing them for hunting they were more of a oddity with not many available. As I recall your argument for gun control and my argument against (it's been awhile)we were talking about weapons in the millions that have been easily available to the masses for decades. There are already more than enough firearms for any criminal who wants one and before many years the same will be true of crossbows. It's probably not going to change but I wanted to point out what many disputed in the crossbow debate. I have a whole raft of examples but you got the picture. My breaks over, back to shoveling snow.Coming down damm near as fast as I can shovel.
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    DanesDad
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 15:29:39 (permalink)
    I think his point is, with xbows legal, it is easier for poachers to operate. Maybe there are poachers now using xbows, that used to use 22s. They were poachers before, and they are poachers still, but now they are silent. The xbow probably didn't create many poachers, but it's common availibility and legality makes poachers more efficient.
    #26
    spoonchucker
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 15:31:02 (permalink)
    Assault rifles are/were "commonly" owned? "Cop killer" ammunition?

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    #27
    chicken27
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 16:54:23 (permalink)
    I think if i would wanted to poach a deer i would use a 22 mag.I understand that they make noise but they would probably drop a deer in there tracks with a 22 mag.How do these guys shoot these deer with the xbows an find them?Do they try to spine them or what?Also you're right s-10 about the xbows since they legalize them they're alot easier to get your hands on one but no matter what there will always be slobs out there.
    #28
    S-10
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 17:36:09 (permalink)
    Assult rifles and cop killer ammunition are two of the most mis-used and mis-understood words the anti gunners ever came up with. There is no such thing and there have been many attempts to describe what the anti's want. The so called cop killer bullets were actually developed by two cops to try and penetrate car windows. Assult rifles are defined on how they look, not what they can do. Surely you knew that.

    In the 1960s, Paul Kopsch (an Ohio coroner), Daniel Turcos (a police sergeant), and Donald Ward (Kopsch's special investigator), began experimenting with special purpose handgun ammunition. Their objective was to develop a law enforcement round capable of improved penetration against hard targets, such as windshield glass and automobile doors. Conventional bullets, made primarily from lead, often become deformed and less effective after striking hard targets, especially when fired at handgun velocities. The inventors named their company "KTW," after their initials.

    After some experimentation with steel rounds, the officers settled on a brass core. Unlike lead, which is relatively malleable, brass wore out barrels far more quickly than normal jacketed rounds, since the brass did not reform to fit the rifling. This is one reason the bullets were then coated with a layer of Teflon to reduce barrel wear. The inventors had also noted that canes were frequently tipped with the relatively soft Teflon to help them grip surfaces. They expected that coating the bullets with Teflon would reduce dangerous ricochets when fired through vehicle doors and windows.[1]

    In 1982, NBC ran a special on the bullets and argued that the bullets were a threat to police. Gun control organizations in the U.S. labeled Teflon-coated bullets "cop killers" because of the supposedly increased penetration the bullets offered against ballistic vests, a staple of the American police uniform. Supporters of gun control believed that the Teflon coating was responsible for this increased penetration[2] despite the fact that the material is only an outer coating for the brass penetrator and usually peels off during its trajectory through the air.

    #29
    get the gaff
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    RE: Didn't take long 2010/01/02 20:17:22 (permalink)
    Crossbows are weapons , People are the killers , Don't confuse this ! The last thing we need is Hunters against Hunters ! So get over the leagalization of crossbows, because you don't want them! I personally don't own one , YET! I don't own an assalt weapon but I'm smart enough to no not to start complaining about them. Hunters need to stick together more now than ever!
    #30
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