You could look at the 4 WMU split season as a good example.  I was against it at the time and I felt there was significant political pressue to do something.
 
The PGC looked at the issue, decided on 4 WMU's and a study that may turn out to benefit us all with increased doe tags potentially.  I was against it but they compromised and it seems to not have had much of a effect. 
 
If it does turn out that allocations can be increased with a 1 week antlerless season, may be a wash if crossbows add significantly to the antlerless harvest or could allow some more non-residents to aquire tags. 
 
Maybe it will go statewide at some point.  Who knows what the data will reveal, but I was against it.  Looking back now, the compromise seems acceptable instead of other options.
  

ORIGINAL: dpms

You could look at the 4 WMU split season as a good example.  I was against it at the time and I felt there was significant political pressue to do something.

The PGC looked at the issue, decided on 4 WMU's and a study that may turn out to benefit us all with increased doe tags potentially.  I was against it but they compromised and it seems to not have had much of a effect. 

If it does turn out that allocations can be increased with a 1 week antlerless season, may be a wash if crossbows add significantly to the antlerless harvest or could allow some more non-residents to aquire tags. 

Maybe it will go statewide at some point.  Who knows what the data will reveal, but I was against it.  Looking back now, the compromise seems acceptable instead of other options.
 

 
There's a big difference here comparing this to crossbows.
 
 
Most hunters wanted more deer in those WMU's.
 
 
Most hunter did not want crossbows in archery.
 
62% of a 101,000 member organization opposed it.  There were four (4) crossbow 'hunters' at the headquarters Sunday.

ORIGINAL: SilverKype

It is so ironic -- that the crossbow folks had only terrible things to say about bowhunters and the UBP.  Now, statewide, they'll be taking advantage of the fruits of their labor.  I guess the question that now deserves an answer, is, should the UBP continue to fight annually for the two weeks in November -- since a superior hunting tool has been introduced into the season they worked so hard for.


I now wonder what the PA Crossbow Federation is going to become.  Is it -- going to continue to have an out of state contact ? 

 
Not all of those in favor of crossbow expansion or inclusion stooped to the level you claim.  There is plenty of blame to go around on both sides for hitting below the belt. 
 
I still support the UBP as a whole,  not very fond on some of the leadership at this point though.  I have defended the organization many times and will continue to do so. 
 
As to if they should continue to fight for the two weeks in November, I guess I would if I wanted to hunt it I would fight for it. 
 
The PCF is starting the application process for a board of directors.  I would assume that the organization will become home based but I am just guessing.  BTW, not a member myself. 

I understand not all did dpms. 
 
You have to understand the majority of the BOD and the leadership of the UBP are traditional archers -- and I say that as 'recurve and longbow.'  The comments still fly around the organization about compound hunters using training wheels .. and cheating.   For some reason the vast majority of compound shooters are okay with that.  I accept and am perfectly fine with it.
 
 
Ed Wenzler said months ago that there will be some major relationship repairs that will need attention after this.  He was right on.

I sure hope Cal Dubrock got a fire lit under him to keep track of this thing and avoid the data debacle from October. 

A few things I didn't get to say before --- because doc trout would have emailed to the commissioners ... 
 
 
I would have loved to see Commissioner Isabella swear under oath that he'd never sell crossbows.  
 
Because he stated "I don't sell crossbows and don't intend to"  -- he should have been excluded from the vote.
 
For complete fairness reasons.    For those unaware here .. he owns a some type of store.  Don't know much about it though.  I heard it was geared toward Police eqiupment .
 
And drakes observation of Palone is accurate.   She did pay attention much of the time but spent plenty of time whispering in Carl Roe's ear.  Someone said she was actually flipping through a magazine during some of the testimonies.  I saw the flipping, but can't comfirm it was a magazine.
 
Mike Schmit and Delany seemed to be the most attentive.  Weaner was too far for me to see his eyes.
 
 
Now, trout, go ahead email it to the Commissioners.

Not many people put beliefs in front of money.   Next time you stop there tell them someone out there is very impressed !!!

ORIGINAL: bingsbaits

Stopped at our local ARCHERY shop last night to shoot in the DART league..They are not going to sell or service arrowguns at the shop..Cutting off their nose to spite their face..But got to admire their resolve..He said they were an archery shop and will only deal with archery equipment...

 
I'll be impressed...if it lasts.

My thoughts on the issue....
 
I'm overall disapointed that crossbows are now going to be introduced.
 
I'm pleased that powered scopes arent allowed.
 
I'm concerned that archery season will be shortened eventually.
 
I've been trying to play out in my mind how many people this will bring into the archery woods this coming season. I don't personally know anyone who is even considering buying an xbow, but the guys who would arent my crowd.
 
I get the feeling there will be a high number of xbows purchased at first. Many of the guys who buy them will have the wrong idea about how easy it will be, and when they find out it's not going to be the same as rifle season and they do have to work to get a deer, the number of xbow hunters the following year will sharply decrease. Now before any of you guys say i'm calling xbow hunters lazy, let me clarify my comments.... Think of it this way, most of the guys who use the crossbows will be rifle hunters who are used to doing drives, and seeing lots of deer running back and forth past them all day. If you want to be successful in archery season, you cant rely on other hunters to push deer to you. This will be hard for a lot of guys to get used too.
 
 

ORIGINAL: thedrake

I get the feeling there will be a high number of xbows purchased at first. Many of the guys who buy them will have the wrong idea about how easy it will be, and when they find out it's not going to be the same as rifle season and they do have to work to get a deer, the number of xbow hunters the following year will sharply decrease. Now before any of you guys say i'm calling xbow hunters lazy, let me clarify my comments.... Think of it this way, most of the guys who use the crossbows will be rifle hunters who are used to doing drives, and seeing lots of deer running back and forth past them all day. If you want to be successful in archery season, you cant rely on other hunters to push deer to you. This will be hard for a lot of guys to get used too.

 
I agree with you.  I expect a quick jump, leveling off in a few years then slowly head down hill.  Just at a slower rate than previous hopefully.
 
These new participants will find out quickly that some effort and planning will be required to be successful on a regular basis.

Seems kind of odd how this all played out..I was against Full Inclusion and thought with the vote we would all know one way or the other..
 
I have been reading alot on here and another site..Seems with Full Inclusion as it stands come many questions..
 
What to do with the Disability permit??  Is there still a need ? If not then the disabled would loose an advantage they could very well use...Or possibly under a new amendment to let permit holders use scopes there by needing to permit disabled hunters again.....
 
 
How will they track the use and the potential affect of crossbows??  Seems data collecting isn't the PGC's strong suit...
 
What if the number of new hunters is no where near their target numbers??? As others have said on here..Big turn out first couple years then a slow loss of hunters..
 
I personally don't think you will see more than 50,000 more archery tags sold the first year and declining from there...I think optics will become an enticer to get more involved when the numbers begin to decline down the road..
 
I sure hope and pray the Blue Army doesn't take them up in force..Archery season in Sparta township would be a big stinky poopoo....Mabee I'll have a talk with the "Red Gods" about that....
 
 
 
 
 
 

ya right, you would think boom boxes, tvs, and telephones were to mechanical for them too.

They all archery hunt here...Kinda makes it tough hunting some times...



They do kill some monster bucks though..

Dane---You should see them when they go by my house every Sunday..You can here them coming 1/4 mile away..They have one of the buggies set up with some huge speakers and a pretty good power amp...
Kinda funny actually..
Crossbows would be allowed through out their whole community.....

ORIGINAL: bingsbaits

What if the number of new hunters is no where near their target numbers??? As others have said on here..Big turn out first couple years then a slow loss of hunters..

I personally don't think you will see more than 50,000 more archery tags sold the first year and declining from there...I think optics will become an enticer to get more involved when the numbers begin to decline down the road..

I sure hope and pray the Blue Army doesn't take them up in force..Archery season in Sparta township would be a big stinky poopoo....Mabee I'll have a talk with the "Red Gods" about that....

 
Bings,
 
You are starting to sound like me.
 
Anyway, I agree with S-10.  The blue army will be buying out those Hortons.

Since I don't have a X-bow and probably never will; I still have some questions that members of our hunting cabin are asking. They are older guys that may want to give it some consideration. Can you get a second shot from a tree stand if you miss the first? How do you **** it while in a climbing stand? Do you carry it to your stand in the cocked position?    My question is; does Pope and Young reconize deer taken with an X-bow as an archery killed deer? If not, then it's not archery hunting,is it? I've been around bow hunting for over 44 years; and the majority of people that had a desire to use one were just looking for the easy way to bow hunt without the need of practice. The PGC is in another desperation mode to try any gimic to bring in more dollars. Their minds were probably made up on the vote before the first person voiced their opinion.