FishUSA.com Forums
Forums Home Search Photo Gallery Calendar Policies Logout Old Boards FishUSA.com Tackle Shop My Profile My Forums My Subscriptions My Address Book My Inbox Member List RSS News Feed

Log In      

RE: gas prices dropped again

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [Pennsylvania Boards] >> Off Topic Discussions - Pennsylvania >> RE: gas prices dropped again Page: <<   < prev  1 [2] 3   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/29/2008 11:46:11 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rapscallion

Sorry man but you're just not going to convince me that gas prices have been skyrocketing for the better part of two years and as soon as the announcement the offshore drilling ban will be lifted in the USA is announced, they immediately begin to drop.
There is a definite correlation between those two events and it is definitely not coincidental that they correlate.

Right , economics. You wont see any effect from the "drilling" for 20 years if your lucky. Under bush, the oil companies leased out more land than ever in history, but no production, why? Economics. Politics, not fear. These nations that are so scared will be laughing(I mean shivering) all the way to the bank for many,many years, as long as we continue to use oil and not  alternitive fules. It is more profitable to be in bed with these terified friends of bush and the gov. Its all a plan. They are all on the same team. I dont think their scared one bit.

< Message edited by jonnyfishon -- 7/29/2008 11:49:05 PM >

(in reply to Rapscallion)
Post #: 31
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 3:07:54 AM   
waDerboy

 

Posts: 1971
Joined: 10/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rapscallion

Sorry man but you're just not going to convince me that gas prices have been skyrocketing for the better part of two years and as soon as the announcement the offshore drilling ban will be lifted in the USA is announced, they immediately begin to drop.
There is a definite correlation between those two events and it is definitely not coincidental that they correlate.


At most what it proves is that they gouged us to a point that they figured their boy Geogre could say that with no repercussions. Oil that may or may not be on the market in 10-20 years has no bearing on the price of oil today.
On the other hand,driving less, keeping the house a few degrees warmer in the summer and cooler in the winter do. So does China pulling half the cars off of Bejing's streets and closing half it's factories in hopes of cleaning it's air for the olympics. Added together that is a significent reduction in usage and therefore  the speculators (not the arabs) are running scared.

(in reply to Rapscallion)
Post #: 32
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 4:07:47 AM   
pghmarty


Posts: 4409
Joined: 12/5/2004
From: Bradford Pa then Pittsburgh
Status: offline
I am just thrilled that my hard earned money is going into some
semi-retired billionaire's retirement fund.

He might need another billion to leave to his cat when he is worm food.


Why did they shoot Regan and not Bush

(in reply to waDerboy)
Post #: 33
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 7:48:26 AM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pghmarty

I am just thrilled that my hard earned money is going into some
semi-retired billionaire's retirement fund.

He might need another billion to leave to his cat when he is worm food.


Why did they shoot Regan and not Bush


Because they could get to him. Im pretty sure if they could get to bush they would. I mean Rock might jump in front of the bullet. (could not help myself rock)

< Message edited by jonnyfishon -- 7/30/2008 10:31:08 AM >

(in reply to pghmarty)
Post #: 34
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 10:39:56 AM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
bush's anouncement definately effected these price drops,so has the cut back in demand, your 10-20 yts before supply is bullsh--t, 6 months max for a few,some less than yr,, 10-20 yr wait is liberal talking point, and china and russia said no way cutting back, keep going full steam ahead,while we sit back do nothing,,hell they are drilling off our shores ,wheres GORE and the other greenie weenies, must be because they arent americans,we are the only one destroying the world enviro, china only cutback cause of olympics, then gun ho again,,what no one wants to admit is jan/2007,all hell broke loose,economy was cruising along ,slow but forward,gas was descent price,then the liberals took over,this is what we got today, so live with it, you wanted it ,you got it,

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to jonnyfishon)
Post #: 35
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 10:47:31 AM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
dont forget there is more demand on oil than just gas for your car,,every aspect of our economy is dependent on petroleum, the plastic industry is a major part of oil surge, tires for your car,paint,tars,shingles on your roof ,cant even list them all, so gas conserving does a little effecting price but not soley, lift the drill ban will effect that price more than anything,flood the market

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 36
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 12:51:19 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ROCKHARD

bush's anouncement definately effected these price drops,so has the cut back in demand, your 10-20 yts before supply is bullsh--t, 6 months max for a few,some less than yr,, 10-20 yr wait is liberal talking point, and china and russia said no way cutting back, keep going full steam ahead,while we sit back do nothing,,hell they are drilling off our shores ,wheres GORE and the other greenie weenies, must be because they arent americans,we are the only one destroying the world enviro, china only cutback cause of olympics, then gun ho again,,what no one wants to admit is jan/2007,all hell broke loose,economy was cruising along ,slow but forward,gas was descent price,then the liberals took over,this is what we got today, so live with it, you wanted it ,you got it,

Not true. There are many oil wells in this country that are not producing. If the price of oil drops to lets say 50$ a barrel, the oil companies will cap most wells until it is more profitable . Once again the liberals never took over completly, the economy was cruisng along on a track that ended. You blame one year to 7 years of irriesponsible spending, rising inflation(tax). Its almost pointless to argue with someone who thinks tricle down economics works or ever worked. Its been proving by most economist that it does not work. Gas was a decent price when clinton was in office. In fact it was 1.47 a gallon national averge when you boy bush took office who is from big oil along with 18 of his original cabinet memebers,and then there is the vice president. Bullsh!t, this administration is all about oil. Its kind of ironic that oil is so high. But your right, If you have a tree service buiness, you dont want storms and high wind to knock down trees and put money in your pocket. Your full of sh!t with your liberal crap. The funny thing is I really dont have a party. I just have common sense. ONCE AGAIN, THE GOV AS A WHOLE IS GUILTY OF BEING GREEDY, BUT THIS ADMINISTRATION SHOULD BE PUT TO DEATH.

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 37
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 12:56:58 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
The U.S. Energy Information Administration (EIA) recently did a detailed study of the likely outcome of offshore drilling for their Annual Energy Outlook 2007, “Impacts of Increased Access to Oil and Natural Gas Resources in the Lower 48 Federal Outer Continental Shelf (OCS).” The sobering conclusion:

The projections in the OCS access case indicate that access to the Pacific, Atlantic, and eastern Gulf regions would not have a significant impact on domestic crude oil and natural gas production or prices before 2030.

(in reply to jonnyfishon)
Post #: 38
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 1:01:02 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
At one time there were numerous rig building companies that simply built land rigs. As they closed up shop, the drilling contractors took on building their own rigs. Today, that is where we are.
"If they build too many, demand drops and day rates decline. Any mention of potential LOWER oil prices HALTS rig building."
Offshore, a jackup rig will take 2-3 years and a semi 3-4 years.
Seeing that we just lost several shipyards along the Gulf Coast, well, the MODU's might have to be made elsewhere, meaning more time. And just like their cousins onshore, offshore rig building slows or stops if there is any hint oil prices might decline...
If you look at the rigs we lost in the Gulf this year, and then remove the 5 going to ARAMCO for their offshore project, we will be a few years just getting back the rigs we lost to the storms, and another few to replace those the Saudis leased. And that just gets us back to the number of rigs we had in 2004...

(in reply to jonnyfishon)
Post #: 39
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 1:03:35 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
jonjon,you speak the liberal crap,not i,, defend the dem congress, majority is majority ,no matter how you look at it, when did these prices skyrocket,jonjon,in the last yr,,,, actually,the cycle of the economy actually started to slow in the last yr or so of clinton,all industries go up and down,some worse than others, its called cycles jonjon,as far as gas price under clinton,they were cheaper yet under reagan, keep going backwards ,they are cheaper yet, cost of living goes up ,not down thru yrs,used to also buy milk for less than .50 a gallon, used to buy autos under 5,000.00.,who we blame them rises on,, hell bottled water is higher per gallon than gas,no one complaining there, its just its not political

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to jonnyfishon)
Post #: 40
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 1:04:09 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
I dont know where you get your substace from but its not credible. 6 MONTHS when it take 2 to 3 years to drill offshore. I think your delusional.

< Message edited by jonnyfishon -- 7/30/2008 1:48:52 PM >

(in reply to jonnyfishon)
Post #: 41
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 1:08:39 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
nope wrong again jonjon, we have drill co, that drill 1,400 to 1,600 ft in 30 days, from drill to market,6 months to a yr,, we supply these outfits, its our business

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to jonnyfishon)
Post #: 42
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 1:19:04 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ROCKHARD

nope wrong again jonjon, we have drill co, that drill 1,400 to 1,600 ft in 30 days, from drill to market,6 months to a yr,, we supply these outfits, its our business

THAT EXPLAINS IT. Show me proof that an offshore rig can be up and running(producing) in 6 month to a year. Show me any proof of what you say without the right wing spin to in. I am not a liberal and only started talking politics on the forum. I read, listen to the radio(both sides),and look up economist veiws to form my opnions and point out facts .

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 43
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 1:30:14 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
well, jon jon,take my word,look it up somewhere,i cant show you, all i know we supply co.,that say they can, if i find one i will post it,ok, actually dont know about off shore time,these companies  do all dry land drilling,well not all but most, our orders are based on from time they start to time for next drill site, why we work ,7 days a week,around the clock, still cant keep up, basically its not the dreaded 10 to 20 yr wait you hear on media reports,

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to jonnyfishon)
Post #: 44
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 1:39:25 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ROCKHARD

jonjon,you speak the liberal crap,not i,, defend the dem congress, majority is majority ,no matter how you look at it, when did these prices skyrocket,jonjon,in the last yr,,,, actually,the cycle of the economy actually started to slow in the last yr or so of clinton,all industries go up and down,some worse than others, its called cycles jonjon,as far as gas price under clinton,they were cheaper yet under reagan, keep going backwards ,they are cheaper yet, cost of living goes up ,not down thru yrs,used to also buy milk for less than .50 a gallon, used to buy autos under 5,000.00.,who we blame them rises on,, hell bottled water is higher per gallon than gas,no one complaining there, its just its not political

NO KIDDING, CYCLES. Thats what this is a cycle. You speak the right wing crap. If anyone blames the people in charge for 7 out of the 8 years you attack. I cannot blame the CLINTON ADMINISTRATION for the complete and obvious failures of the bush administration. If CLINTON was in I would be all over him as well, I would not blame someone else. Gas started to rise a year into bush term(majority is majority) give me some substance will ya rockrock. This is not your normal "CYCLE" . If you believe it is than that would be your opinion, but not a fact. The Facts say something different. I wish IT was a democratic president right now so I could bash him for worsening the middle class. Like I said before, ron paul for pesident. BUT NO WERE STUCK WITH DUMB AND DUMBER.

< Message edited by jonnyfishon -- 7/30/2008 1:44:50 PM >

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 45
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 2:01:50 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
The Democrats "Big Lie"

"This is the worst economy since Herbert Hoover."


The "Ten Bullets" To Shoot Down That Lie

1. Unemployment rate after GWBush's 3rd year is identical to after
Clinton's 3rd year.
2. Family poverty rate is lower, on average, under GWBush than under
Clinton.
3. "Deep" poverty rate is lower, on average, under GWBush than under
Clinton.
4. Homeownership rate is now higher than anytime in history.
5. Inflation rate fell more under GWBush than Clinton and is now lower
after GWBush's 3rd year than Clinton's 3rd year.
6. Growth rate of the national debt per American is nearly the same as
during the 1990s.
7. Federal Deficit as a % of GDP is nearly the same as the past six
decades average.
8. Number of people employed rose more than number of unemployed under
GWBush.
9. Tax burden for middle-class families was reduced FAR more than for
"rich" families.
10. Average hourly and weekly earnings rose more under GWBush than
Clinton and are now higher than ever in history.


(note, now the unemployment rate is down to 4.7%, that means even
Mulay can land a job if he wants one)

The Details

1. Unemployment Rate -

Jan 2004: 5.6% (After GWBush's 1st three years)
Change in rate from prior year (Jan '03-'04): 0.3%, Decrease

Jan 1996: 5.6% (After Bill Clinton's 1st three years)
Change in rate from prior year (Jan '95-'96): 0.0%, No change
* The Unemployement Rate is the same after GWBush's 1st three years as
it was after Bill Clinton's 1st three years.
* The Unemployment rate steadily declined in the third year with
GWBush while it remained unchanged in Bill Clinton's third year.
Source:
Bureau of Labor Statistics




2. Poverty Rate For Families (Two-Year Average) -

2001-2002: 9.40% (GWBush's 1st two years)
1993-1994: 12.95% (Clinton's 1st two years)
1993-2000: 10.50% (Average for Clinton's full eight years)
* The % of families living in poverty is lower after two years under
GWBush than after two years under Bill Clinton - even lower than 7 out
of 8 of Clinton's years in office.
Source:
US Census




3. Percent of People Below 50 Percent of Poverty Level (Two-Year
Average) -

2001-2002: 4.95% (GWBush's 1st two years)
1993-1994: 6.05% (Clinton's 1st two years)
1993-2000: 5.31% (Average for Clinton's full eight years)
* The % of people living in deep poverty is lower after two years
under GWBush than after two years under Bill Clinton - even lower than
the average across Clinton's entire TWO terms of office... AND lower
than ANY of Clinton's 1st six years in office.
Source:
US Census




4. Homeownership Rate -

GWBush's 1st three years:
4th Quarter 2000: 67.5% (before GWBush)
4th Quarter 2003: 68.6% (after 3 years of GWBush)
Difference: +1.1%

Bill Clinton's 1st three years:
4th Quarter 1992: 64.4% (before Clinton)
4th Quarter 1995: 65.1% (after 3 years of Clinton)
Difference: +0.7%
* The Homeownership Rate is higher under GWBush's 1st three years than
under Bill Clinton's 1st three years.
* The Homeownership Rate grew MORE in the 1st three years with GWBush
than in the 1st three years with Bill Clinton.
Source:
US Census




5. Inflation Rate -

GWBush's 1st three years:
Jan 2001: 3.73% (before GWBush)
Jan 2004: 1.93% (after 3 years of GWBush)
Difference: 1.8% Decrease

Bill Clinton's 1st three years:
Jan 1993: 3.26% (before Clinton)
Jan 1996: 2.73% (after 3 years of Clinton)
Difference: 0.53% Decrease
* The Inflation Rate is lower after three years of GWBush than it was
after Bill Clinton's first three years.
* The Inflation Rate declined over three times greater under GWBush
than under Bill Clinton.
Source:
InflationData.com




6. National Debt per American Citizen -

1940-1950: Increased at 11.2% annual rate. (WWII and reconstruction)
1990-2000: Increased at 1.6% annual rate. (no lengthy military
conflicts)
2000-2004: Increased at 2.5% annual rate. (Afghanistan, Iraq,
reconstruction and war on terror)
* The national debt per citizen is growing at a rate nearly equal to
the "peace-time" rate of the 1990s.
Sources:
US Treasury
US Census
CPI-calculator




7. The Federal Deficit As A Percentage Of GDP -

Avg. Post-WWII (1946-2002): 1.6%
GWBush Budget (2002-2008): 1.8%
* As a % of The GDP, The Deficit Under GWBush Nearly Identical To The
58-Year, Post-WWII Average.
Sources:
American Farm Bureau Federation Analysis
Citing OMB Statistics



8. Employment Numbers (Total US Civilian labor force ) -
GWBush Starts, Jan 2001:
Employed: 135,999,000
Unemployed: 5,956,000
"discouraged": 303,000

3 Years Later, Feb 2004:
Employed: 138,301,000 (+2,302,000 more than 2001)
Unemployed: 8,170,000 (+2,214,000 more than 2001)
"discouraged": 484,000 (+184,000 more than 2001)
* Number of employed people increased by 88,000 more than the number
of unemployed people under GWBush.
* Even factoring in those who're "discourged" and stopped looking for
work, the increase in unemployed+discouraged was less than 100,000
more than the increase in employed.
Sources:
Bureau of Labor Statistics
Bureau of Labor Statistics




9. Tax Burden, "Middle-Class Family" compared to "Rich Family"-

Taxes Owed by "Middle-Class Family", Head of Household, 2 kids,
$35,000/yr Income:
Before Bush Tax Cut: $1,128
After Bush Tax Cut: $328
Net Change: $800 LESS taxes owed.

Taxes Owed by "Rich Family", Head of Household, 2 kids, $250,000/yr
Income:
Before Bush Tax Cut: $65,879
After Bush Tax Cut: $61,963
Net Change: $3,916 LESS taxes owed.
* Effect of Bush's Tax Cut On "Rich Family": Tax Burden Reduced by
5.94%
* Effect of Bush's Tax Cut On "Middle-Class" Family: Tax Burden
Reduced by 70.95%
Source:
Heritage Foundation




10. Earnings, Private Sector (all figures in 2004 dollars,
CPI-adjusted) -

Average Hourly Earnings Under GWBush:
Jan. 2001: $14.79
Feb. 2004: $15.52 (+4.9% increase)
Average Hourly Earnings Under Clinton:
Jan. 1993: $14.29
Feb. 1996: $14.33 (+0.3% increase)
* +4.9% Increase In Avg Hourly Earnings Under GWBush's 1st Three
Years.
* +0.3% Increase In Avg Hourly Earnings Under Clinton's 1st Three
Years.
Average Weekly Earnings Under GWBush:
Jan. 2001: $507.27
Jan. 2004: $523.56 (+3.2% increase)
Average Weekly Earnings Under Clinton:
Jan. 1993: $493.35
Jan. 1996: $487.87 (-1.1% decrease)
* +3.2% Increase In Avg Weekly Earnings Under GWBush's 1st Three
Years.
* -1.1% Decrease In Avg Weekly Earnings Under Clinton's 1st Three
Years.
Sources:
Bureau of Labor Statistics
Bureau of Labor Statistics

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to jonnyfishon)
Post #: 46
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 2:21:43 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
  • Debt Reduction Relative to GDP4
    The national debt is the net amount of debt held by the federal government ($3.9 trillion in 2003).5 It increased under both administrations (in today's dollars). But under Clinton the debt rose more slowly and GDP rose faster than under Bush. The result is that the ratio of debt to GDP went down an average of 3.89 percent per year during the Clinton years, but has gone up an average of 0.94 percent per year during the Bush years.

  • Trade Deficit Reduction Relative to GDP6
    The trade deficit increased during both administrations. It increased by 0.52 percent of GDP per year under Clinton and by 0.37 percent per year under Bush.7 This is one of two indicators where economic performance under Bush appears to be better than it was during the Clinton administration. But underneath that data is a less flattering story for the Bush years. The trade deficit grew at the rate it did under Clinton for two main reasons: because the first Bush Administration's recession had cut imports to an artificially low level, and because the economy was expanding rapidly. People were confident, so they were buying a lot of imported goods. Businesses were growing, too, so U.S. factories were importing materials to manufacture their products. Throughout this period, export growth was very strong. In the Bush years, the trade deficit has been a product of a different, and less healthy dynamic: U.S. exports have dipped dramatically relative to imports.

Employment

  • Jobs8
    One of the most important measures of economic well-being is the number of people with jobs. The number of jobs in the economy increased 2.38 percent per year under Clinton, but it has decreased 0.17 percent per year under Bush.9 While it's clear that the economic downturn in 2001 was not Bush's fault, the sluggishness of the recovery is unprecedented in the period since the federal government began issuing detailed employment reports in the 1940s. There have been 1.7 million jobs created since September 2003, which may sound like a lot, but that number falls short of the 1.8 million jobs that must be created per year just to match population growth, and it falls far below the 3.7 million jobs that the administration predicted would be created when the president signed his 2003 tax cut into law.10 This slow job growth is largely attributable to both the failure of the administration's fiscal policies (which targeted tax cuts to stimulate savings rather than spending) and the failure of its trade policies (which have done a poor job of opening foreign markets to spur export growth, and have not created the conditions for an orderly decline in the value of the dollar, which would have helped ease the trade imbalance).11

  • Full-time vs. Part-time Jobs12
    The change in the number of jobs does not provide a complete picture of employment in the U.S. economy. Not only did the Clinton years produce many more jobs than the Bush years have, but they also produced more full-time jobs compared to part-time jobs. This is an important indicator because in an economic slowdown many displaced and new workers resort to part-time work as a second-choice option. Granted, some people might prefer part-time work because they have children or attend school. But, overall, a decrease in the ratio of full-time to part-time jobs implies that a greater share of workers have less stable work with fewer benefits. The ratio of full-time to part-time work rose under Clinton by 0.11 percent per year, but it has decreased at an annual rate of 1.67 percent since the beginning of 2001. In fact, the ratio of full-time to part-time jobs has not only reversed direction, but as of September 2004 it has fallen below what it was before Clinton took office.



  • Jobs with Good Wages
    The economic well-being of American workers is determined not only by whether they have jobs -- ideally full-time jobs with benefits -- but also by how well their jobs pay. This indicator is a weighted index based on the change in the number of jobs in different income quintiles under Clinton and Bush.13 A positive value represents job growth biased toward higher paying jobs, which reflects an upwardly mobile economy. A negative value represents job growth biased toward lower-paying jobs, which reflects a more downwardly mobile economy. The score of 4.70 during the Clinton administration means that the economy produced significantly more jobs in high-wage quintiles than in the low-wage quintiles. In contrast, the score of -1.0 during the Bush administration substantiates reports that new jobs created under Bush have generally paid worse than the jobs that have been lost. For example, from 2000 to 2003, the economy added 540,820 jobs in the lowest-wage quintile. Meanwhile, 451,440 jobs were lost in the middle quintile and 357,900 jobs were lost in the two highest quintiles.14

  • Americans with Health Insurance15
    Since most working Americans with health insurance get it through work, changes in the share of Americans who have health insurance is another indication of the quality of jobs in the economy. Under the Clinton administration, the share of Americans covered by health insurance went up 0.12 percent annually. Under Bush, there has been a 0.55 percent yearly decrease. Even more striking is that 5 million more Americans were without health insurance in 2003 than in 2000 and 3.8 million fewer Americans had employment-based health insurance.16

Incomes

  • Productivity17
    Productivity measures the amount of economic output that each hour of work produces. It is an important indicator of economic performance because high rates of productivity traditionally correlate with strong growth in living standards. The most accurate measure of productivity covers non-farm businesses. During the Clinton administration non-farm business productivity grew 1.83 percent per year. During the Bush administration, it grew by an average of 3.76 percent per year. This is one of the only bright spots in a period of otherwise lackluster economic performance, and it is a measure that suggests hope for the economy in the coming years. But it is important to note that the late 1990s saw both productivity growth and job growth, producing a double benefit for the economy. During the Bush years, productivity has grown while jobs have not. Whether the nation can maintain the robust levels of productivity growth we have enjoyed since 1996 depends in large part on whether we put in place the right policies, including investments in research and development, and the skills of the workforce; promotion of the digital economy, including high-speed broadband deployment; and fiscal discipline to keep interest rates low.18

  • Per Capita GDP19
    Simply comparing the annual growth of GDP under each administration would be misleading, because the population continues to grow. Per capita GDP -- in other words, how much output there is each year relative to the total population -- is a more accurate measure. While per capita GDP rose 2.42 percent under Clinton, it has risen just 1.62 percent per year during the Bush presidency. In large part, this is because fewer people are working.

  • Median Household Income20
    Median household income is the best measure of American families' well-being because it shows the true economic mid-point of the population. By definition, half of all households make more than the median, and half make less. (Average household income figures are bad measures of overall well-being, because a small percentage of very rich families can skew the picture, making everyone appear to be richer than they are.) Median household income has fallen an average of 1.15 percent per year under Bush. It rose an average of 1.65 percent per year under Clinton.

  • Poverty Reduction21
    Poverty statistics are telling indicators of the country's economic health. The number of Americans below the poverty line fell 2.29 percent annually in the Clinton years, but has since gone up 4.33 percent annually in the Bush years.

  • Homeownership22
    No economic indicator can embody the American dream in quite the same way as homeownership. Indeed, one of the successes that President Bush frequently points to under his watch is the increase in homeownership. But while the home ownership rate has increased 0.37 percent per year during the Bush administration, that is a slowdown compared to the average increases of 1.94 percent during the Clinton administration


Your right wing numbers dont hold water.

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 47
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 2:32:50 PM   
spoonchucker


Posts: 5903
Status: online
"Sorry man but you're just not going to convince me that gas prices have been skyrocketing for the better part of two years and as soon as the announcement the offshore drilling ban will be lifted in the USA is announced, they immediately begin to drop."

Scallion,

All he did was lift the EXECUTIVE ban, the BAN itself is still in effect, and likely to remain so. His token action had NOTHING to do with oil prices goiing down. 


_____________________________

Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference.

Step Up, or Step Aside

The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody.

GL&TC

(in reply to rapala11)
Post #: 48
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 2:33:28 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
well,jonjon,theres your substance,we both found one,that contradict each other,so what that mean,yours is right ,mine is wrong,or both are probably bs,hoping you dont read the other

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to jonnyfishon)
Post #: 49
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 2:41:17 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
yes spoon,it had a part to do with it, among other factors,, you believe me not driving my truck tomorrow will drop it again, or if i do drive my truck it will go up,, thats assinine,,, we could all stop driving for 3 days a week,still not much effect alone,without the stopage of oil products being produced in manufacturing,and other uses, gasoline is only a small portion of what petroleum is used for,,,, look at it this way spoon,you had a product everyone needed,so price was high,and i came along with same product and cut your sales ,wouldnt you cut price on your product to stay viable

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 50
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 2:45:56 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
thats right spoon,now who is holding up the ban now,I WONDER,even with prices dropping,you left wingers still complain and blame someone,if it was 2.00/gal,we hear it should be 1,75/gal, 

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 51
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 2:50:29 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
listened to a caller on KDKA,TUESDAY,he works in the solar energy business,and said the energy and cost to produce solar energy out ways the benifits, it takes more energy to produce these capacitors needed,than what the panel puts out,and the by waste products are enormous

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 52
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 2:52:05 PM   
spoonchucker


Posts: 5903
Status: online
 
"1. Unemployment rate after GWBush's 3rd year is identical to after
Clinton's 3rd year."






1992
7.5

1993
6.9

1994
6.1

1995
5.6

1996
5.4

1997
4.9

1998
4.5

1999
4.2

2000
4.0

2001
4.7

2002
5.8

2003
6.0

2004
5.5

2005
5.1

2006
4.6

2007
4.6


You might also note that the UR in Clintopn's 3d year was significantly higher than what he was left with, while in Bush's 3rd year is was significantly than what Clinton left him.

_____________________________

Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference.

Step Up, or Step Aside

The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody.

GL&TC

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 53
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 2:57:32 PM   
spoonchucker


Posts: 5903
Status: online
"you believe me not driving my truck tomorrow will drop it again, or if i do drive my truck it will go up,, thats assinine,,,"

No your statement, is assinine. Believe this or not, there are a few million others besides yourself to consider. A ONE MPG increase in every car in America, would save more oil than the HIGHEST estimated output of ANWR.

_____________________________

Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference.

Step Up, or Step Aside

The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody.

GL&TC

(in reply to spoonchucker)
Post #: 54
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 3:01:34 PM   
spoonchucker


Posts: 5903
Status: online
"look at it this way spoon,you had a product everyone needed,so price was high,and i came along with same product and cut your sales ,wouldnt you cut price on your product to stay viable"

This statement really does not fit into any context of your post. BUT it DOES fit into the arguement, I have been making. WHEN the oil companies, instead of just having acces to more oil, have to COMPETE with OTHER energy sources for our dollar, YES the price will go down.  


_____________________________

Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference.

Step Up, or Step Aside

The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody.

GL&TC

(in reply to spoonchucker)
Post #: 55
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 3:09:51 PM   
spoonchucker


Posts: 5903
Status: online
"yes spoon,it had a part to do with it, among other factors,, "

It didn't add a drop of oil to the market, and isn't going to. So HOW did it affect the market. The reduction of consumption ( at a higher rate than offshore drilling can increase production ), is REAL, and the biggest factor in falling prices. The market analysts for the guys who were doing the buying acknowledged this. Of course YOU know why they are willing to pay less, not the guys doing it.

_____________________________

Get Informed, Get Involved, And Make A Difference.

Step Up, or Step Aside

The next time you say "Somebody should do something", remember that YOU are somebody.

GL&TC

(in reply to spoonchucker)
Post #: 56
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 3:49:29 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ROCKHARD

well,jonjon,theres your substance,we both found one,that contradict each other,so what that mean,yours is right ,mine is wrong,or both are probably bs,hoping you dont read the other

Nope , mine is right. Rockrock, don't feel bad , we all make mistakes.

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 57
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 3:59:12 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
according to your numbers spoon,clinton yrs dropped with a repub house,strict on govt spending,and also seems like bushs numbers dropped also until dems took control, could be all cyclable,but the arguement is in the numbers you posted,they dropped thru 2007 ,  as far as oil, you believe what you want spoon, it dont bother me one bit, dont like the prices, but also not going to spout off blame to suite your political agenda, facts are dems holding up drilling,so pay till the roof falls,you believe that drilling wont help,thats your right,not worth arguing over, any report you come up with can be countered by the same, prices are droppong ,so be satisfied, i showed you an example of product demand and you said not viable,, if you dont want to drive and use gas,fine, i like to go, there is no alternative out there, not going to stop my life waiting when we got the energy in the ground, i heard one analyst make a good statement once,   WHAT ARE WE SAVING THIS OIL IN THE GROUND FOR, if we cant use it,what good is it,,, that makes sense spoon, as far as bushs statement,you dont know the market, the threat that we can do without foreign energy,does a lot to influence price on world market, but its funny you believe bush and his cronys can control the upward price by being in oil,how can he effect it one way but not the other,simple,cause he cant

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to spoonchucker)
Post #: 58
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 4:00:41 PM   
ROCKHARD


Posts: 807
Joined: 10/13/2007
Status: offline
jonjon, like with spoon,we say wheres the substance,well which version

_____________________________

WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A FAILURE TO COMMUNICATE,, SOME MEN YOU JUST CANT REACH

(in reply to ROCKHARD)
Post #: 59
RE: gas prices dropped again - 7/30/2008 4:01:02 PM   
jonnyfishon

 

Posts: 1263
Joined: 2/7/2008
Status: offline