This is what's wrong with our system. (Full Version)

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Over the Hill -> This is what's wrong with our system. (7/2/2008 4:31:41 PM)

QUICK summary: 

Three adult males and a 16 yr old conspire to shoot a guy. One of the males, 20yrs old, shoots at the victim, missing him, while his buddies get into the line of fire, and he narrowly avoids him them also.

Victim and another witness goes to police, ID them, and the four get arrested for various charges, INCLUDING ATTEMPTED MURDER, POSSESSION OF A STOLEN FIREARM, NO LICENSE TO CARRY FIREARMS.







This happened August of 2007 in Monroe County Pa. They admitted during police questioning and before the judge they did it. Please find the time to read one of the Pocono Record newspapers stories at: http://www.poconorecord.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070830/NEWS/70830012/-1/NEWS05. Try not to laugh at the article.

What do you think the judge should have sentenced them to, and what do you honestly think they were sentenced to?

I will post the decision from the judge in a day or two, trying to give people on the board here a chance to respond. Hope your sitting down having a cold one and relaxed when you read it.

REMEMBER: There is a five year MANDITORY SENTENCE  in PA for using a firearm in a violent crime!





Over the Hill -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/2/2008 6:34:11 PM)

No takers? lots of lookers....



ROCKHARD -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/2/2008 6:47:25 PM)

i myself see it as,, life in prison,without parole,,might sound harsh,,but this is the reason why our gun rights are always in battle



Mikastorm -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/2/2008 6:59:15 PM)

The 911 records should be proof enough. Guilty.



Inukshuk -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/2/2008 10:15:33 PM)

I think they should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law, whatever that is.  If it is five years then they should get five years with no chance of parole.  I would hope it is atleast five years.



gobyking -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/2/2008 10:56:11 PM)

With the system we have,I'll guess 2-3 years for the shooter with the remainder of the 5 years on probation for him.The others involved maybe 2 years probation.Maybe even charges dropped for three of the four attackers that didn't have the gun.But,by the looks of the article,it sounds like they were trying to get a dismissal.The 911 tapes wouldn't have any gunshots on it since the 4 were gone when the "victim" called and the witnessing neighbors weren't interview(great police work there).

They should have paid him the money he was owed for drugs and this wouldn't have happened.They could all be cruising around in their sh!tboxes with overly loud mufflers,smoking a blunt and playing loud rap music now.

Eh,they probably are anyway.



MuskyMastr -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/2/2008 11:25:18 PM)

My guess is criminal mischef and 3 yrs probation.



pappy69 -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/2/2008 11:27:31 PM)

Sorry, I couldn't read the whole article without falling asleep, so I'm probably wrong. My take is that the perpertrators are,
guilty of not knowing how to handle and fire a weapon and guillty of not choosing an appropriate target.  Perhaps a test should be given to people who want to fire a gun, just as it is to people who want to drive an automobile.  This doesn't deny an individual the right to bare arms, but it does ask that they know and understand what they are doing.  Meanwhile, they must subject their identification to the scrutiny of the community.



CRAPPIE_SLAYER -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/3/2008 6:21:09 AM)

Didn't read the article, but they'll probably plead insanity at the time of the crime and get off scott free.  Seems to work for alot of others [:@].



Over the Hill -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/3/2008 5:59:35 PM)

THE SENTENCING:

The shooter PLED GUILTY to "firing a gun into an occupied residence"  and reckless endangerment. HE RECIEVED A 1 TO 4 YEAR SENTENCE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

In Monroe county it is VERY common for convicts to serve only HALF of their minimum sentence if they have good behavior. This guy can be out on the street in 6 months.

Plea bargains---a bargain for the criminals!!! What a JOKE this is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Where is the five year manditory sentence for using a firearm in a violent crime? Somebody please explain this to me.

The DA's office should be fired! He will not get my vote next election.



Over the Hill -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/4/2008 5:27:47 PM)

I guess I'm the only one who thinks this sentence is a joke?



CATMAN610 -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 8:45:48 AM)

OTH,,The whole system is a joke that bends over backwards for scum like these,,,,btw, I didn't notice did it say where the gun came from?



Over the Hill -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 9:14:29 AM)

The gun was stolen and he bought it from a drug dealer. Another one of the 20,000 laws on the books that are NOT enforced.



ROCKHARD -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 9:26:41 AM)

oth, it is a joke,, i wondered same thought,5 yr mandatory sentance,,,, if we looked hard enuff,possibly related to someone in the upper class, lot of pork flying around when someone needs elected,



Over the Hill -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 9:46:32 AM)

The name is unfamiliar to me as far as be related to someone. It really looks like the DA's office took the easy way out. Next election he can say how many people he "prosecuted" and sent to jail. I'm trying to find out now how many of these so called "cases" were pleaded out and not prosecuted to the fullest extent. Maybe if the convicts when they are released had to live in the judges, defense attorneys, or prosecuters neighborhoods we would see a difference. Who wants them living in their nieghborhood?[;)]

The other two adults PLEADED, and recieved 1-2 years for "conspriracy to commit aggravated assault". The juvenile, 16 yrs old at the time, I haven't heard about what he recieved.



aranbp -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 12:20:33 PM)

they reduce the sentence to avoid a trial.  It seems that they never enforce the 5 year rule.  I agree with you that it is a joke.  the law is the law.



spoonchucker -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 1:02:11 PM)

There are lots of things that have to be considered. One is the probability of conviction. From what I read, al involved ( even the victim ) were a bit shady, so how would their testimoney hold up in court? Another is cost. In a perfect world there would be no plea bargains, but to take every case to court, would require a huge increase in the entire judicial system. More prosecutors, more judges, public defenders, and courtroom staff. This added cost, wouldn't make folks happy either. Especially if trial didn't result in conviction.

It sure isn't a perfect system, but sometimes you have to do the best you can, with what you have.



Over the Hill -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 2:59:13 PM)

A  chance of conviction in this case? They admitted to it. http://www.poconorecord.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070808/NEWS/70808004

I never said it was a perfect system and I never said it was the worst. From what I know of from other countries, I still think our court system is the best in the world. There is room for a lot of improvement though.

As far as paying for more judges, jails, etc... I would rather pay that way than pay for the crimes they are commiting. IE: chance of innocent people getting shot buy this guy, or paying more in homeowners ins. to cover the cost of the person's gun that was stolen. We pay either way really...



rapala11 -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 4:04:33 PM)

oth, i have buddies who are cops and the frustrations you present are the same they have expressed.  i feel for you in that you want this to come to a justifiable end, and i really hope it does.  seems as though the deck is stacked against honest guys at times, doesn't it?



gobyking -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 9:24:44 PM)

Rap,my brothers an officer and is also disgusted when he puts a wife beater,thief,or druggie away.

Short story...Local scumbag in Florida suburb of Tampa where I worked for 3 three years always begged for money to by 40's and crack.This guy(white guy)had a nickname Bigguns because before he started the crack and booze,he was 6'4" 300 lbs.Anyway he lost the weight(crack) and was impervious to a taser because the flabby leftover skin and somehow it wouldn't take effect on him,so pepper spray was used on him from then on.Last time I remember he was arrested,he faked passing out an a bus bench like he usually did to try to get a jump on an officer who was trying to wake him up and move him along.He had a scuffle and was handcuffed.Getting into the ambulance(he normally complained of fake medical problems to go to the hospital first,knowing how the system worked and all) he ended up breaking a female paramedics fingers and was charged with another felony to add to his long rap sheet because he assaulted a paramedic.This would be good for firefighter,paramedics,and police.He was sentenced 2+ years.Judge let him out in 6 months just before Christmas because the jails were to overcrowded.Guess what,he was back on the streets the next night drinking,hustling,and strongarming people. 



Inukshuk -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/5/2008 9:57:50 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Over the Hill

I guess I'm the only one who thinks this sentence is a joke?


You are right, it is a joke.  I think this reflects a weakness that is apparent in our society.  It happens in our courtrooms and school systems, and in society in general.  Nobody wants to be held accountable for anything anymore.   Example:  Not to long ago, a Philadelphia police officer was responding to a call, as soon as he stepped out of his vehicle, he was gunned down with an automatic machine gun, needless to say he did not survive.  The criminal responsible had 17 previous convictions.  Now what was this animal doing out on the street?  The resulf of some pedantic judge who is missing several vertebrae and a set of balls.  Now this cops kids are without a father, and society has to pay for his life sentence. The cop was only 39 years old.



Over the Hill -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/6/2008 2:37:30 PM)

Rap, I think that's part of the reason why law enforement has some of the highest rates of divorce,depression and suicide.

People aren't accountable for their actions. They were abused, they had a rough childhood, they were economically disadvantaged. There's a million excuses.....



rapala11 -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/6/2008 2:50:31 PM)

oth, you're right.  my fishing partner years ago was a small town police chief.  he often talked of the frustrations of pinching a bad guy, only to see him on the streets real quick.

as for people with rough pasts committing crimes, i feel for them.  but it doesn't give them carte blanche to circumvent the law.  these laws are for everyone.  i once knew a petty thief who had some stuff stolen....you should have heard him whine.  another, who dealt some bad stuff, complained the cops were always harrassing him.........duh.

i think again that the judiciary has some faults.  what is scary is that at any given time, we have 2000000 folks incarcerated in this, the freest country in the world.  a lot of the problems have to do with family structure.  and if the family doesn't act as a cohesive unit, even with divorce a factor, then we denigrate as a society.  kids need to feel loved, to respect life and to live honestly.  this has got to come from parents. 



Over the Hill -> RE: This is what's wrong with our system. (7/6/2008 3:02:11 PM)

I agree with you on raising kids. Parents to be active in their lives. They're the foundation for the child.



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