RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others

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RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 3:20:45 PM

Cold

Posts: 1013
Joined: 3/27/2008
From: Latrobe, PA
Status: offline

First off...weakest division? Please. A year or two ago, no doubt, but this year, all three of their divisionmates are showing some surprising amounts of potential. Super Bowl winning potential? Probably not. But potential nontheless.

Second, really, you should learn that someone disagreeing with you doesn't mean its a personal attack. You think The Patriots are essentially Brady and those other guys. I think that any team with Moss, Welker, Seymour, Vrabel, Bruschii, etc. still shows some promise. Now, I'm not saying that Brady is an insignificant loss. To the contrary, with Brady under center, I'd guestimate that final score would be more like 38-27 New England. He runs the offense much better than Cassel for one big reason: it's HIS offense. Again, what season record would you give the Steelers if Ben developed a bad case of the Mange and was out for the season, paving the way for Leftwich (or better, Dixon, in terms of NFL starts) to take the reins and continue the season? Our offense would suck. For a long, long time, until they learned to gel with the new QB. That would keep them to 3 and outs, which would in turn place huge strain on a tired defense. Its a ripple effect that would be a crusher for almost any team, and no coach can get a situation like that to function like a well-oiled machine in 3 weeks time. Nobody.

For the record, I cant stand the Pats, and am basking in their situation as much as anyone. I think both Brady and Belichik are arrogant and petty, but at the same time, I'm rational enough to see that they're both very good at what they do.

...and if you disagree, I'm rational enough to accept that.

(in reply to Rapscallion)

Post #: 301

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 3:21:24 PM

Grendel

Posts: 2403
Status: offline

You are right - you are not the sharpest tool in the shed for sure.

1. Where did I say i was excited about the Bills?
2. Where did I say i had Super Bowl aspirations?
3. When you make comments about how weak another division is, the tendency is to look at a comparison (ever hear of ethnocentrism?). However, being a dull blade, I am sure that is easy for you to overlook.

You are too easy and boring.

Doc

_____________________________

Science like nature
Must also be tamed
With a view towards its preservation
Given the same state of integrity
It will surely serve us well ~ NP

(in reply to Rapscallion)

Post #: 302

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 3:58:34 PM

Rapscallion

Posts: 244
Joined: 5/24/2008
Status: offline

Ahhh, finally catching on charley. Ums not nirley as smurt as yu. Um tu eicy ind boowrin. Go bulls!

(in reply to Grendel)

Post #: 303

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 4:07:15 PM

Porktown

Posts: 2413
Joined: 9/4/2001
Status: offline

I guess that O line from last year is back again... Who was it on here, that was saying Hartwig was a good signing???

My biggest issue with the game yesterday (besides the O line play), was the play calling. If a team blitzes 9 out 10 plays, you've got to adapt. That quick route mixed with runs, basically the same offense that the Pats have run for the last few years seems to be the only way. If they stop the run, you lose 1-2 yards. If they don't, you usually end up with 6+ yards. If your quick reads are covered, you intenionally overthrow them out of bounds. They have a few pretty sure handed recievers that can pull this off.

Possibly the QB can't though. Ben does seem to be a heck of a lot more accurate after he has shed two tacklers and pump fakes 3 times... So, maybe it wasn't a possibility to change the play calling. If that is the case, I'd expect every team out there to do the same thing until they can counter. Not every team has the ability to leave their corners 1:1 like the Eagles do.

I was rather shocked at the limited amount of times they had Ben in shotgun too. This would likely get him ready to unload a lot quicker. Although, they may have been scared that the defensive front might beat the snap to him.

That all said, at least they weren't getting that pressure with a 3 or 4 man rush, like they were letting up last year. The Eagles defense isn't all that bad.

The Stiller defense looked pretty good. Buttholder was the only one on the Eagles doing any sort of harm to them. Probably worked out in the Eagles favor that Westbrook went down, as I'd imagine the Stiller's game plan revolved around stopping him. Hopefully he is fine. I like the Eagles when they aren't playing the Stillers.

(in reply to Grendel)

Post #: 304

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 6:36:05 PM

Rapscallion

Posts: 244
Joined: 5/24/2008
Status: offline

Look man, this all started when I said I think we know who misses who more, belichick or brady. You can't compare the Steelers with Tomlin and big Ben because Tomlin hasn't been called a genius for the past six years. It's not a valid comparison because there is none.
The point is the pats still have the same supposed genius coach but now that they have lost brady, he no longer looks like a genius. It's quite obvious where and why he acquired his reputation.
If he is such a great coach, he should have no problem overcoming this latest obstacle as he has supposedly always done in the past. The big difference now is he has always had brady to bail him out. Now, that is not the case. It's a typical case of someone getting way more credit than they ever deserved. Don't see why that is so hard to understand.

quote]ORIGINAL: Cold

First off...weakest division? Please. A year or two ago, no doubt, but this year, all three of their divisionmates are showing some surprising amounts of potential. Super Bowl winning potential? Probably not. But potential nontheless.

Second, really, you should learn that someone disagreeing with you doesn't mean its a personal attack. You think The Patriots are essentially Brady and those other guys. I think that any team with Moss, Welker, Seymour, Vrabel, Bruschii, etc. still shows some promise. Now, I'm not saying that Brady is an insignificant loss. To the contrary, with Brady under center, I'd guestimate that final score would be more like 38-27 New England. He runs the offense much better than Cassel for one big reason: it's HIS offense. Again, what season record would you give the Steelers if Ben developed a bad case of the Mange and was out for the season, paving the way for Leftwich (or better, Dixon, in terms of NFL starts) to take the reins and continue the season? Our offense would suck. For a long, long time, until they learned to gel with the new QB. That would keep them to 3 and outs, which would in turn place huge strain on a tired defense. Its a ripple effect that would be a crusher for almost any team, and no coach can get a situation like that to function like a well-oiled machine in 3 weeks time. Nobody.

For the record, I cant stand the Pats, and am basking in their situation as much as anyone. I think both Brady and Belichik are arrogant and petty, but at the same time, I'm rational enough to see that they're both very good at what they do.

...and if you disagree, I'm rational enough to accept that.

[/quote]

(in reply to Cold)

Post #: 305

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 7:21:36 PM

Grendel

Posts: 2403
Status: offline

The Pats losing one game certainly does not mean the NFL and fans should be sounding the death knell on them. The AFC is still wide open with no clear-cut favorite to take the conference. The final judgement should come after the season is over. Way too early for prognosis.

Doc

_____________________________

Science like nature
Must also be tamed
With a view towards its preservation
Given the same state of integrity
It will surely serve us well ~ NP

(in reply to Rapscallion)

Post #: 306

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 7:49:37 PM

beerman

Posts: 3699
Joined: 1/14/2002
From: Key West, Florida
Status: offline

Strongest Division in PRO Football:

1) NFC East
2) AFC South (maybe)
3) SEC Conference
4) ?

_____________________________

changes in latitudes, changes in attitudes....nothing remains quite the same

The Beerman ~ Greg

(in reply to Rapscallion)

Post #: 307

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 8:00:48 PM

Grendel

Posts: 2403
Status: offline

I agree Beerman - NFC East is the Beast this year.

_____________________________

Science like nature
Must also be tamed
With a view towards its preservation
Given the same state of integrity
It will surely serve us well ~ NP

(in reply to beerman)

Post #: 308

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 8:06:49 PM

Grendel

Posts: 2403
Status: offline

Jets or Bolts tonight?

Doc

< Message edited by Grendel -- 9/22/2008 8:07:35 PM >

_____________________________

Science like nature
Must also be tamed
With a view towards its preservation
Given the same state of integrity
It will surely serve us well ~ NP

(in reply to Grendel)

Post #: 309

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 8:42:23 PM

Cold

Posts: 1013
Joined: 3/27/2008
From: Latrobe, PA
Status: offline

I hope Bolts. I need Tomlinson and Gates to perform. I also hope its a shootout, since in one league, I'm going against the SD defense.

quote:

Look man, this all started when I said I think we know who misses who more, belichick or brady. You can't compare the Steelers with Tomlin and big Ben because Tomlin hasn't been called a genius for the past six years. It's not a valid comparison because there is none.
The point is the pats still have the same supposed genius coach but now that they have lost brady, he no longer looks like a genius. It's quite obvious where and why he acquired his reputation.
If he is such a great coach, he should have no problem overcoming this latest obstacle as he has supposedly always done in the past. The big difference now is he has always had brady to bail him out. Now, that is not the case. It's a typical case of someone getting way more credit than they ever deserved. Don't see why that is so hard to understand.

Wow....you're really worse than trackstat, for real. You really mean to tell me you're passing judgement on a 3 time super bowl champion coach because he lost a game? As far as the comparison, while it is perfectly legit, I'll play along: I'll let YOU pick the team, the coach, the star quarterback, OK?

Now...

quote:

what season record would you give <INSERT TEAM OF CHOICE HERE> if <INSERT STAR QB OF CHOICE HERE> developed a bad case of the Mange and was out for the season, paving the way for <INSERT FAR LESS SKILLED BACKUP HERE> to take the reins and continue the season? Their offense would suck. For a long, long time, until they learned to gel with the new QB. That would keep them to 3 and outs, which would in turn place huge strain on a tired defense. Its a ripple effect that would be a crusher for almost any team, and no coach can get a situation like that to function like a well-oiled machine in 3 weeks time. Nobody.

Happy?

I really think you were just looking for mass approval by bashing a generally hated coach, and now that you've found opposition, you're grasping at straws to justify your stance not by offering any real reasons for your opinion (since you have none, because you cant make an accurate judgement based on one loss), and instead you've decided to repeat your opinions ad nauseum.

Try to remember that, with less than one full half with Brady, the Pats are STILL 2-1. Try to keep in mind that the loss of the quarterback of ANY team will give them serious issues to resolve, regardless of the coach. Try to keep in mind that two weeks is not enough to make a judgement call on the coaching, even if those two weeks went 0-2. Try to keep in mind that throughout last season, while there were many blowouts in their schedule, there were also the games that the Pats won by the skin of their teeth. Particularly remember their game vs. Baltimore, that gave Miami their first (and only?) win last year, that the Pats only managed to win due to some questionable calls from the zebras.

If you can see all of this and you still think that you can legitimately say Belichik isn't a talented coach, I'd like to see some REAL evidence. Numbers, stats, anything, just make it concrete. I don't want to hear "With Brady they have X yards per game and without him they have Y yards!" Give me something that clearly points to Belichik's coaching that has changed, for the worse, in the past two games. Bad play calls (which are really more their O-Cord anyway), poor clock management, bad substitutions, that sort of thing. And remember that even if you DO find something like that, you've got to tie it into Belichik making that bad decision BECAUSE Brady isn't playing.

Hard to do? It should be, because its a moronic notion at best.

(in reply to Grendel)

Post #: 310

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 8:49:10 PM

Grendel

Posts: 2403
Status: offline

I like Favre, but would love to see the jets remain grounded.

Doc

_____________________________

Science like nature
Must also be tamed
With a view towards its preservation
Given the same state of integrity
It will surely serve us well ~ NP

(in reply to Cold)

Post #: 311

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 8:57:20 PM

Cold

Posts: 1013
Joined: 3/27/2008
From: Latrobe, PA
Status: offline

I like Favre too, and I have Cotchery in one league, but the Chargers could use a win. They got robbed the first two weeks, once by a pretty lucky play, and once by a pretty crappy call.

(in reply to Grendel)

Post #: 312

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 9:14:48 PM

Grendel

Posts: 2403
Status: offline

No closing your eyes on this game! Bolts are charging for sure!

Doc

_____________________________

Science like nature
Must also be tamed
With a view towards its preservation
Given the same state of integrity
It will surely serve us well ~ NP

(in reply to Cold)

Post #: 313

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 9:21:52 PM

Rapscallion

Posts: 244
Joined: 5/24/2008
Status: offline

Whatever you say buddy. Seems like you have all of the answers. Certainly don't need my help with anything. Hope you're not a betting man though. If you are, I'd take your money off the pats. Maybe put it on bill for the coach of the year award. Much better chance of winning there. LOL!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cold

I hope Bolts. I need Tomlinson and Gates to perform. I also hope its a shootout, since in one league, I'm going against the SD defense.

quote:

Look man, this all started when I said I think we know who misses who more, belichick or brady. You can't compare the Steelers with Tomlin and big Ben because Tomlin hasn't been called a genius for the past six years. It's not a valid comparison because there is none.
The point is the pats still have the same supposed genius coach but now that they have lost brady, he no longer looks like a genius. It's quite obvious where and why he acquired his reputation.
If he is such a great coach, he should have no problem overcoming this latest obstacle as he has supposedly always done in the past. The big difference now is he has always had brady to bail him out. Now, that is not the case. It's a typical case of someone getting way more credit than they ever deserved. Don't see why that is so hard to understand.

Wow....you're really worse than trackstat, for real. You really mean to tell me you're passing judgement on a 3 time super bowl champion coach because he lost a game? As far as the comparison, while it is perfectly legit, I'll play along: I'll let YOU pick the team, the coach, the star quarterback, OK?

Now...

quote:

what season record would you give <INSERT TEAM OF CHOICE HERE> if <INSERT STAR QB OF CHOICE HERE> developed a bad case of the Mange and was out for the season, paving the way for <INSERT FAR LESS SKILLED BACKUP HERE> to take the reins and continue the season? Their offense would suck. For a long, long time, until they learned to gel with the new QB. That would keep them to 3 and outs, which would in turn place huge strain on a tired defense. Its a ripple effect that would be a crusher for almost any team, and no coach can get a situation like that to function like a well-oiled machine in 3 weeks time. Nobody.

Happy?

I really think you were just looking for mass approval by bashing a generally hated coach, and now that you've found opposition, you're grasping at straws to justify your stance not by offering any real reasons for your opinion (since you have none, because you cant make an accurate judgement based on one loss), and instead you've decided to repeat your opinions ad nauseum.

Try to remember that, with less than one full half with Brady, the Pats are STILL 2-1. Try to keep in mind that the loss of the quarterback of ANY team will give them serious issues to resolve, regardless of the coach. Try to keep in mind that two weeks is not enough to make a judgement call on the coaching, even if those two weeks went 0-2. Try to keep in mind that throughout last season, while there were many blowouts in their schedule, there were also the games that the Pats won by the skin of their teeth. Particularly remember their game vs. Baltimore, that gave Miami their first (and only?) win last year, that the Pats only managed to win due to some questionable calls from the zebras.

If you can see all of this and you still think that you can legitimately say Belichik isn't a talented coach, I'd like to see some REAL evidence. Numbers, stats, anything, just make it concrete. I don't want to hear "With Brady they have X yards per game and without him they have Y yards!" Give me something that clearly points to Belichik's coaching that has changed, for the worse, in the past two games. Bad play calls (which are really more their O-Cord anyway), poor clock management, bad substitutions, that sort of thing. And remember that even if you DO find something like that, you've got to tie it into Belichik making that bad decision BECAUSE Brady isn't playing.

Hard to do? It should be, because its a moronic notion at best.

(in reply to Cold)

Post #: 314

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 9:23:13 PM

Rapscallion

Posts: 244
Joined: 5/24/2008
Status: offline

wahtvere u cay duc. ur hte sartm noe.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Grendel

The Pats losing one game certainly does not mean the NFL and fans should be sounding the death knell on them. The AFC is still wide open with no clear-cut favorite to take the conference. The final judgement should come after the season is over. Way too early for prognosis.

Doc

(in reply to Grendel)

Post #: 315

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/22/2008 11:09:25 PM

Deadbolt401

Posts: 1618
Joined: 11/6/2007
Status: online

Rolandburgers a bum!

_____________________________

"You Know your a redneck when your gun rack has a gun rack!"

(in reply to Rapscallion)

Post #: 316

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/24/2008 12:39:51 PM

track2514

Posts: 1811
Joined: 9/26/2003
Status: offline

http://www.postgameheroes.com/?p=3643

Here is a pretty good breakdown of the Roethlisberger sacks, I agree with the author's assessment.

_____________________________

If its brown flush it down. Here we go Steelers...

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Post #: 317

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/24/2008 3:50:46 PM

*commander*

Posts: 1834
Status: offline

you agree with all sportswriters, espn anchors, sportscasters, etc... you change your mind and turn your stories every week depending on the games outcome.

(in reply to track2514)

Post #: 318

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/25/2008 8:16:00 AM

beerman

Posts: 3699
Joined: 1/14/2002
From: Key West, Florida
Status: offline

Why would the Steelers rule out Parker and Hampton for Monday night's game so early?
One would think they should have made the Ravens prepare to play against them, then
declare them out at the last minute.

Realize the Browns haven't won any game this season, including all of preseason.

_____________________________

changes in latitudes, changes in attitudes....nothing remains quite the same

The Beerman ~ Greg

(in reply to *commander*)

Post #: 319

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/25/2008 9:24:54 AM

kingnuke32

Posts: 268
Joined: 5/21/2001
From: Greensburg
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: beerman

Why would the Steelers rule out Parker and Hampton for Monday night's game so early?
One would think they should have made the Ravens prepare to play against them, then
declare them out at the last minute.

Realize the Browns haven't won any game this season, including all of preseason.

Thats the reason for an Injury report in pro football so Vegas can get the lines on the games right. The other pro sports dont have the same IR as the NFL does ... hmm wonder why that is.

(in reply to beerman)

Post #: 320

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/25/2008 9:53:23 AM

D-nymph

Posts: 2337
Joined: 9/19/2001
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: beerman

Why would the Steelers rule out Parker and Hampton for Monday night's game so early?
One would think they should have made the Ravens prepare to play against them, then
declare them out at the last minute.

Realize the Browns haven't won any game this season, including all of preseason.

Like kingnuke said. NFL requires injuries to be reported by Wednesdays. Mainly for gambling odds makers, even though they won't admit it. And some teams are more forthcoming than others. For example, half of the Patriot club is "questionable" every week.

(in reply to beerman)

Post #: 321

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/27/2008 11:31:32 PM

beerman

Posts: 3699
Joined: 1/14/2002
From: Key West, Florida
Status: offline

I'm hoping this Sunday, it will be the game, the Cleveland Browns finally put it together offensively. The Bengals played the Giants last week and could/should have won. Maybe Jamal Lewis can get things turned around and they can get a win, 27-16. (DREAM ON)

The Ravens are decent on defense, but their offense has no passing game and their running attack is below average. Playing on a Monday night in front of a roudy home crowd, the Pittsburgh defense should feast on Ravens + rookie QB Joe Flacco. Steelers to win 24-10.

_____________________________

changes in latitudes, changes in attitudes....nothing remains quite the same

The Beerman ~ Greg

(in reply to D-nymph)

Post #: 322

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/29/2008 5:27:19 PM

beerman

Posts: 3699
Joined: 1/14/2002
From: Key West, Florida
Status: offline

Are there any Steeler fans that want to make a prediction on tonight's game?

IMO Steelers to win 24-10.

_____________________________

changes in latitudes, changes in attitudes....nothing remains quite the same

The Beerman ~ Greg

(in reply to beerman)

Post #: 323

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/29/2008 8:07:16 PM

STEELYS MANFISH

Posts: 298
Joined: 2/4/2008
Status: offline

steelers 17 and balt. browns 3. GO STEELERS!!!!!

(in reply to beerman)

Post #: 324

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/29/2008 8:59:38 PM

tippy-toe

Posts: 4460
Joined: 11/21/2005
From: under a rock
Status: online

I'm cheering for your boys tonight cause my dad is a Stillers fan...

Mendenhall(SP) looks pretty good...

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I have the right to remain silent.....I just don't have the ability

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Post #: 325

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/29/2008 9:20:22 PM

tippy-toe

Posts: 4460
Joined: 11/21/2005
From: under a rock
Status: online

Am I just having PMS or are these commentators extra annoying tonight...and I like Jaws..

_____________________________

I have the right to remain silent.....I just don't have the ability

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Post #: 326

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/29/2008 9:31:54 PM

STEELYS MANFISH

Posts: 298
Joined: 2/4/2008
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they are awful. there irritating me. Id rather have the women from the view as the analysts its that bad.

(in reply to tippy-toe)

Post #: 327

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/29/2008 9:38:21 PM

kingnuke32

Posts: 268
Joined: 5/21/2001
From: Greensburg
Status: online

Horrible and Jaws is as anti pittsburgh as madden is.

(in reply to STEELYS MANFISH)

Post #: 328

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/30/2008 6:42:35 AM

LDD

Posts: 1076
Joined: 5/20/2004
Status: offline

I cannot stand Tony KORNHOLER...he is super annoying! Did you hear him take the Eagles lyrics before the game...how gay was that.
Good for the Stillers for pulling that one out. I usually don't root for them, but the comments of the new Baltimore coach about how the Ravens were going to become a DYNASTY really came across as arrogant. I guess their dynasty will have to start next week?

GO BILLS!! 4-0 baby...huge game in AZ next week!

(in reply to STEELYS MANFISH)

Post #: 329

RE: 2008 Cleveland Browns ~ Pittsburgh Steelers ~ Others - 9/30/2008 8:45:21 AM

eyesandgillz

Posts: 738
Joined: 6/18/2003
Status: offline

Injuries, especially season ending ones, are starting to pile up on the Steelers. I sure hope there is a decent tailback out on the waiver wire. I guess Mendenhall is regretting sending that text message right now. Ray Lewis took it him on that hit.

Glad they pulled it out but they looked BAD in the first half after Ben's interception on the second drive. They were moving the ball up until that point. Kendall Simmons is out for the year with an achilles injury. Ouch.... Hopefully Trai Essex and Stapleton can fill the gap. Going to be interesting from here on out.

(in reply to LDD)

Post #: 330

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