A vent, has it happened to you?

A vent, has it happened to you?

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A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 12:07:04 PM

jimhalupka

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So, I fish a stream that is not stocked by the pfbc, however, recieves a small spring stocking of adult brown trout, and gets fingerlings in the fall/spring as well. One day, Copebugger and I approach a fellow with 3 trout on a rope. Calmly, we explained that the fish were put here due to efforts from the local TU chapter, and they strongly suggest catch and release. He told us he understood and quit for the day. To make matters worse, it was prime time stockie action as the atp's were just stocked.

Two weeks later, I'm working my way upstream... and what do ya know, he's back, with more fish bleeding out the gills. He then precedes to tell me that he called the pfbc and asked if what we said was true. The commission said that yes, what we said was true, however, no one can enforce the catch and release policy and he was in the right. I asked him why he had to come here and harvest fish that have a chance at reproducing, and that he was basically robbing the pockets of the gentlemen that give the oppurtunity in the first place. He was flabbergasted, I just headed upstream in disgust. Why doesn't the commission do more to enforce regulation on naturally reproducing waterways?? Can the landowner(s) step in and do anything about this? IDDDIOOTTSS.

_____________________________

"Sure, we can assiduously three-quarter our wets downstream, mend and wait out each fly swing, over and over again, which to my way of thinking, anyway, relegates the angler to the role, not of nemesis as it should be, but of butler."

-Art Lee

Post #: 1

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 12:11:44 PM

KJH807

Posts: 3242
Joined: 11/26/2006
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the PFBC sees no benefit in protecting wild trout... one of the higher ups was even quoted saying something along those lines

protecting a resource does not help them make more $$

landowners can shutdown access and make it a permission only thing

"strong suggestions" are not enforceable laws

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Post #: 2

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 12:15:32 PM

pxatim

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I don't know... unfortunatley sounds like the only way to enforce it is to post it and try to control the access to it... there's always that one guy out there....

(in reply to jimhalupka)

Post #: 3

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 12:29:39 PM

RhnstnCowboy

Posts: 1485
Joined: 12/10/2008
From: The Ohio State Reformatory
Status: offline

quote:

recieves a small spring stocking of adult brown trout, and gets fingerlings in the fall/spring as well.

My dad used to stock a stream near our cabin the same way. As soon as people realized the fish were in there, they would come down and keep their limit (or more than their limit) and the fish would be gone in a few weeks... We posted part of our land, but it doesn't matter. There is nothing you can do about it. As KJH said, "suggesting C&R" is not an enforceable law.

< Message edited by RhnstnCowboy -- 11/5/2009 12:30:36 PM >

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"Its a folk singer's job to comfort disturbed people and disturb comfortable people."
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(in reply to jimhalupka)

Post #: 4

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 12:43:02 PM

PACOFRANSICO

Posts: 150
Joined: 11/11/2008
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Thats why i fish outta the way kinda "hush hush" creeks. And I don't spead the knowledge either. Most of the native guys I know are the same. We talk about creeks in general, but to get a spot outta them you'd have to drug them with Sodium Pentothal. My Dad and I went out to such a place in aug. and caught about 40 wild brooks between us and even caught with some wild browns too.

The truth of it is most guys are sportsman I meen you find a few slobs in the bunch...but the guys that target wild trout take the upmost care in catching, handling, and releasing of the wild trout they catch. I love fishing little ditches with lite fly fods. And I'm all for protecting it.

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Time to drag your tongue across the sugar cube and hope you get a taste...

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Post #: 5

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 12:46:29 PM

Loomis

Posts: 1610
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Delmont, PA
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why didn't u just house him? That always seems to work....

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"I am by no means the most logical and educated person about fly fishing, but I will share with you what I know"

(in reply to PACOFRANSICO)

Post #: 6

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 12:54:47 PM

jimhalupka

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I, too, fish nothing but wild/native streams.. and the occasional dhalo, along with this one at hand. It's a sure shame that people are ingnorant to what's really going on in these places.

...and Loomis, he already was missing 80 percent of his teeth... no need to worsen the mess.

< Message edited by jimhalupka -- 11/5/2009 12:56:10 PM >

_____________________________

"Sure, we can assiduously three-quarter our wets downstream, mend and wait out each fly swing, over and over again, which to my way of thinking, anyway, relegates the angler to the role, not of nemesis as it should be, but of butler."

-Art Lee

(in reply to Loomis)

Post #: 7

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 12:59:21 PM

bulldog1

Posts: 1782
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Posted signs only keep out the people that you wouldn't mind having there, my experience anyway, slobs don't see signs.

(in reply to jimhalupka)

Post #: 8

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:02:16 PM

Loomis

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From: Delmont, PA
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even more of a reason, he wont miss any if anymore go missing.

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"I am by no means the most logical and educated person about fly fishing, but I will share with you what I know"

(in reply to bulldog1)

Post #: 9

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:04:44 PM

jimhalupka

Posts: 496
Joined: 12/20/2008
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LOL... for once, I was the cool and collective one. It was 140 pd Smitty aka Copebugger who was fuming and red in the face... Smitty takes care of those fish like their his babies.

_____________________________

"Sure, we can assiduously three-quarter our wets downstream, mend and wait out each fly swing, over and over again, which to my way of thinking, anyway, relegates the angler to the role, not of nemesis as it should be, but of butler."

-Art Lee

(in reply to Loomis)

Post #: 10

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:05:29 PM

Loomis

Posts: 1610
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From: Delmont, PA
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hahaha watch them scrappy farmboys...I could see him gettin a little loose.

_____________________________

http://www.laurelridgerods.com

"I am by no means the most logical and educated person about fly fishing, but I will share with you what I know"

(in reply to jimhalupka)

Post #: 11

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:09:40 PM

pafisher

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That land and stream should be posted and fished by written permission only.If the toothless one shows up after that have him arrested for defiant trespass and then all others would take the hint to stay off.

(in reply to bulldog1)

Post #: 12

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:23:38 PM

jimhalupka

Posts: 496
Joined: 12/20/2008
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it's beautiful water too...

board member 'norm' tying up for a swing

_____________________________

"Sure, we can assiduously three-quarter our wets downstream, mend and wait out each fly swing, over and over again, which to my way of thinking, anyway, relegates the angler to the role, not of nemesis as it should be, but of butler."

-Art Lee

(in reply to pafisher)

Post #: 13

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:41:27 PM

Snowbrdr420

Posts: 61
Joined: 10/16/2008
Status: online

quote:

the PFBC sees no benefit in protecting wild trout... one of the higher ups was even quoted saying something along those lines

KJH, If that is a true statement then how do you explain the wild brook trout enhancement programs created by the pfbc on some streams? Sounds to me like they can enforce

http://www.fish.state.pa.us/fishpub/summary/wildbrook.html

WILD BROOK TROUT ENHANCEMENT PROGRAM

Open to fishing year-round (no closed season).
No brook trout may be killed or had in possession.
There are no tackle restrictions.
The regulations apply to brook trout only; all other species, inland regulations apply.
A current trout/salmon permit is required.

(in reply to KJH807)

Post #: 14

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:43:59 PM

jimhalupka

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Joined: 12/20/2008
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lol I've fished enhancement projects and am not impressed. If you ask anyone who has fished them prior to the pfbc labeling them this and then slapping the location all over the internet, they will tell you the fishing has went downhill.

_____________________________

"Sure, we can assiduously three-quarter our wets downstream, mend and wait out each fly swing, over and over again, which to my way of thinking, anyway, relegates the angler to the role, not of nemesis as it should be, but of butler."

-Art Lee

(in reply to Snowbrdr420)

Post #: 15

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:48:10 PM

Loomis

Posts: 1610
Joined: 9/19/2005
From: Delmont, PA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Snowbrdr420

quote:

the PFBC sees no benefit in protecting wild trout... one of the higher ups was even quoted saying something along those lines

KJH, If that is a true statement then how do you explain the wild brook trout enhancement programs created by the pfbc on some streams? Sounds to me like they can enforce

http://www.fish.state.pa.us/fishpub/summary/wildbrook.html

WILD BROOK TROUT ENHANCEMENT PROGRAM
Open to fishing year-round (no closed season).
No brook trout may be killed or had in possession.
There are no tackle restrictions.
The regulations apply to brook trout only; all other species, inland regulations apply.
A current trout/salmon permit is required.

How do you explain our wonderful PFBC stocking non-native species in a native creek knowing the decimating effects of doing so.

_____________________________

http://www.laurelridgerods.com

"I am by no means the most logical and educated person about fly fishing, but I will share with you what I know"

(in reply to Snowbrdr420)

Post #: 16

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:54:37 PM

RhnstnCowboy

Posts: 1485
Joined: 12/10/2008
From: The Ohio State Reformatory
Status: offline

quote:

How do you explain our wonderful PFBC stocking non-native species in a native creek knowing the decimating effects of doing so.

I beat this topic into the ground and the consensus from most people on this board was that I was a moron, native fish are small and worthless, and pellet-heads are great. I may well be a moron, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong about pellet-heads...

_____________________________

"Its a folk singer's job to comfort disturbed people and disturb comfortable people."
- Woody Guthrie

(in reply to Loomis)

Post #: 17

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 1:56:48 PM

KJH807

Posts: 3242
Joined: 11/26/2006
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Snowbrdr420

KJH, If that is a true statement then how do you explain the wild brook trout enhancement programs created by the pfbc on some streams?

thats attempts to restore native brook trout... not maintaing wild trout populations

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RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 2:01:19 PM

D-nymph

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quote:

ORIGINAL: RhnstnCowboy

quote:

How do you explain our wonderful PFBC stocking non-native species in a native creek knowing the decimating effects of doing so.

I beat this topic into the ground and the consensus from most people on this board was that I was a moron, native fish are small and worthless, and pellet-heads are great. I may well be a moron, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong about pellet-heads...

You're not a moron!

ok, maybe a little bit.

(in reply to RhnstnCowboy)

Post #: 19

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 2:06:11 PM

jolie

Posts: 100
Joined: 7/17/2007
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what are ATP's?

It is a sad story. I'm a bit of a meat angler myself, but I would not harvest from a place like that. There's more to fishing than catching...

Its stories like these that make good sportsman, a little reluctant to say too much. Anonymity is the best policy for places like these.

Can't a landowner give some kind of conditional permission? Like, you can fish on my property, IF you let me know your address/License plate and you agree to C/R fishing, etc....

(in reply to jimhalupka)

Post #: 20

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 2:10:59 PM

KJH807

Posts: 3242
Joined: 11/26/2006
Status: online

my guess is the issues also arise from TU stocking

TU members are not going to pay $ for membership and then not know where the fish get stocked

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RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 2:18:11 PM

RhnstnCowboy

Posts: 1485
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From: The Ohio State Reformatory
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quote:

TU members are not going to pay $ for membership and then not know where the fish get stocked

Is there an App. for that?

_____________________________

"Its a folk singer's job to comfort disturbed people and disturb comfortable people."
- Woody Guthrie

(in reply to KJH807)

Post #: 22

No stocking means no meat anglers?(maybe) - 11/5/2009 2:19:35 PM

jolie

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I think what we're saying ISN'T that the PFBC doesn't HAVE programs about maintaining wild trout, but that they don't do as much as they should.

this mandate doesn't have support of high-ups cuz' its stocking that generates all the income.

And I agree, to a point. but i can see it the other way too. Like it or not, pellethead trout fishermen ARE the main customer for PFBC. and they are unhappy! there's been steep declines in stocked trout. PFBC could IMHO appease both groups and serve there stated mandate better by stocking MORE Trout in LESS places.

Myself, I think its ridiculous HOW many streams the commission stocks and I'm SURE they are stocking over streams up here (NW PA) that could sustain good wild trout populations.

If the given stream were just stocked by TU with no commission involvement-- would the bum meat angler be there?? maybe not. like it or not, meat anglers follow the commission's stock trout... that is Why advocates of wild trout should work on habitat restoration and stock the least amount of trout possible.

(in reply to Snowbrdr420)

Post #: 23

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 2:25:15 PM

jimhalupka

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Joined: 12/20/2008
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jolie

what are ATP's?

It is a sad story. I'm a bit of a meat angler myself, but I would not harvest from a place like that. There's more to fishing than catching...

Its stories like these that make good sportsman, a little reluctant to say too much. Anonymity is the best policy for places like these.

Can't a landowner give some kind of conditional permission? Like, you can fish on my property, IF you let me know your address/License plate and you agree to C/R fishing, etc....

atp's are approved trout waters...

The chapter doesn't stock adults from a membership bought basis... it's not big enough. It's a handful of dedicated fly fisherman who get together and buy them. TU only supports the fingerling stocking financially. I guess I would be in favor of a written permission/posted kind of a thing, but that's only because I've been lucky enough to fish beside and get to know a few of them, hence it would be no problem obtaining the permission. I would truly feel bad for the less fortunate who really do mean well and wouldn't be allowed to fish here for it's also a great carp/small mouth water.

_____________________________

"Sure, we can assiduously three-quarter our wets downstream, mend and wait out each fly swing, over and over again, which to my way of thinking, anyway, relegates the angler to the role, not of nemesis as it should be, but of butler."

-Art Lee

(in reply to jolie)

Post #: 24

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 2:25:42 PM

Dream Catcher

Posts: 881
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From: Lake City , PA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jimhalupka

lol I've fished enhancement projects and am not impressed. If you ask anyone who has fished them prior to the pfbc labeling them this and then slapping the location all over the internet, they will tell you the fishing has went downhill.

I couldn't agree more ...... The only way they may need enhanced would be if natives were extinct from the wastershed in the first place .

< Message edited by Dream Catcher -- 11/5/2009 2:34:12 PM >

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RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 2:44:07 PM

rureadytofish

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I haven't kept a trout to eat in a long time, but I would say that if you wanted a good eating trout, the native brookie can't be beat. Also, how is this a native stream if they are stocking fingerlings?

(in reply to Dream Catcher)

Post #: 26

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 2:53:48 PM

jimhalupka

Posts: 496
Joined: 12/20/2008
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when did I ever say it was a native stream? I said I fish nothing but wild/native streams, dhalo's on occassion, and the one at hand.

_____________________________

"Sure, we can assiduously three-quarter our wets downstream, mend and wait out each fly swing, over and over again, which to my way of thinking, anyway, relegates the angler to the role, not of nemesis as it should be, but of butler."

-Art Lee

(in reply to rureadytofish)

Post #: 27

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 3:10:47 PM

Dream Catcher

Posts: 881
Joined: 9/17/2007
From: Lake City , PA
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You would eat an 8" native ? Seems like an awful lota work for on morsel /?

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hammrin saimens

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Post #: 28

RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 3:20:19 PM

KJH807

Posts: 3242
Joined: 11/26/2006
Status: online

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dream Catcher

You would eat an 8" native ? Seems like an awful lota work for on morsel /?

the dog really doesn't care... he just gives em 2 crunches and they're gone

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RE: A vent, has it happened to you? - 11/5/2009 3:25:28 PM

RhnstnCowboy

Posts: 1485
Joined: 12/10/2008
From: The Ohio State Reformatory
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quote:

You would eat an 8" native ? Seems like an awful lota work for on morsel /?

8 inch cutthroats were the best trout I have ever eaten...

_____________________________

"Its a folk singer's job to comfort disturbed people and disturb comfortable people."
- Woody Guthrie

(in reply to Dream Catcher)

Post #: 30

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