Senate Bill 1168 PFBC

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dano
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2016/10/15 15:44:29 (permalink)

Senate Bill 1168 PFBC

 
http://www.fishandboat.com/Zone1/Documents/SenateBill-1168.pdf
 
In the proposed license fee schedule, this is listed down below under Other provisions:
               Broadens Use of Lake Erie Funds for Public Fishing.
 
Does anyone know what they mean by "BROADER USE"?
 
 
 
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    BeenThereDoneThat.
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/15 16:03:35 (permalink)
    Unless it states broader use for Lake Erie only. SOS. 🎃

    Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a life time. ~Anne Isabella Thackeray Ritchie (1837–1919)~
     
     
     
      Old fisherman never die; we just smell that way. 
     
    #2
    dano
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/16 05:57:41 (permalink)
    What it will do is divert money from the easement program.
    What will happen is that the stamp funds will be used to pay what the was once paid for by the general fund.
     
    Those are some pretty steep fishing license hikes, especially for out of state fishermen. 
    $100 for a senior lifetime?
    #3
    StewFc
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/16 10:20:13 (permalink)
    You're right to be alarmed at that vague language as it allows them to use revenues any way they choose...and pensions have been a big issues for THEM recently. They'll hike the price, use the money for internal purposes and inform you that they were permitted to do so under the vague description. While that's actually a narrower purpose, try debating language with any level of government. They also provide for "Technical Amendments" which is legal speak for changing it as they see fit. AND, they are reserving the right to make decisions on "anticipated" changes in demographics which is to say they can assume whatever they like. The underlined sentence that states the desire to minimize long term impacts is alarming. I'm surprised that made it in a public document...its saying you'll be paying more in exchange for more of what you don't want. "Modest" increases to keep up with rising costs...which they can "anticipate". Lastly, the STEEP increase for 2017 tells you the declining level of participation they anticipate.
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    BeenThereDoneThat.
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/16 12:21:27 (permalink)
    Why the surprise, the PennState Fish And Boat Commission has been working the budget and redirecting funds for years.   Common practice from the smallest of government agencies to the Congress of the U.S.
     
    Not so sure about the retirement thingy but we are aware of the need to repair dams, trout hatcheries, etc.  There are those lakes already drained as well as the lakes that are being drained.  Take Tamarack Lake for example, money budgeted back in 2012-13 for a project that should have been completed this year and the construction is still on the drawing board (thank you EPA or so it's said).  I'll stand corrected but I'm thinking, the money put aside at the beginning for the project, ain't gonna cover today's cost (let alone the convenient "cost overruns") if in fact that money still exist.  John needed some quick money and it ain't being generated by selling buttons.
     
    I'm not being smart when I speak of SOS, from Arway being railroaded into the directors position to John making the project his personal project has got to tell yinz something.   It's been said the PennState Fish and Boat Commission is going beyond their authority doing the work of other agencies such as the EPA.  Which yinz should read the reports generated and see what was found and what has occurred.   Heck, just for chyst and giggles read the entire story, from the very beginning.  For the record I am not disturbed with enhancing, The Susquehanna River or any waterway, just the BS I'M EXPECTED TO SWALLOW.
     
    I'm not against taking care of our waterways, but "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" just because BASS says this is what THEY want before THEY will come to town.   Ummm just an observation on my part.... silly me.
     
    The license fee hike; perhaps if the politicians weren't so afraid of their political careers, there wouldn't have been the need for "special stamp fees" in the first place.
     
    Amazing how we the people of PA will allow our tax on gasoline to be so high then is used for everything except our roads but, don't you touch our fishing license fees.
     
    Heh heh hehhhhh, oooops.... sorry.
     
     
    post edited by BeenThereDoneThat. - 2016/10/16 12:24:06

    Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a life time. ~Anne Isabella Thackeray Ritchie (1837–1919)~
     
     
     
      Old fisherman never die; we just smell that way. 
     
    #5
    StewFc
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/16 12:51:09 (permalink)
    I have flattened my head communicating with low level lackies about the gas tax roughly 3 times per year since 2005. I have also been fitted for the straight jacket that is inevitable as I have tried to get an explanation as to why we're still paying the Johnstown flood tax on bottles of liquor. It's not that we don't care, it's that trying, as a lowly, tax paying, law abiding citizen, to get answers or affect change can be hazardous to your sanity. I try to inform as many people as I can, but I have to devote large swaths of time to earning a living to be taxed to pay the people that have no regard for me.
    #6
    chrisrowboat
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/16 14:09:04 (permalink)
    I've been saying for years they need to increase the amount they will pay per stream mile for easements. "The louder the steelhead fisherman and groups are the more the PAFBC will work in directing those funds". Lake Erie boat fisherman are screaming now but the way the stamp legislation was written it can't  be directed towards it. Boat fund moneys have traditionally been used but the commission sees the amount of of money sitting in the access fund and want into it.
    I've been told this from The Director and by the Commissioners in person.
    Take it for what it is worth.

    Proud to have been a FOT/
    I've been out fishing.
    Clean your gear/
    http://www.fish.state.pa.us/cleanyourgear.htm



    #7
    genieman77
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/16 16:11:11 (permalink)
    chrisrowboat
    I've been saying for years they need to increase the amount they will pay per stream mile for easements. "The louder the steelhead fisherman and groups are the more the PAFBC will work in directing those funds". Lake Erie boat fisherman are screaming now but the way the stamp legislation was written it can't  be directed towards it. Boat fund moneys have traditionally been used but the commission sees the amount of of money sitting in the access fund and want into it.
    I've been told this from The Director and by the Commissioners in person.
    Take it for what it is worth.




     
    Hi Chris....good to see you're still involved  and hope you and family are doing well
     
    I've been out of the game so long,  don't know what's been going on.
    What group of anglers contributes most to the local economy ?
    Boaters or creek steelhesders?
     
    If re$ourses are limited, one would think the best use of them would go to the best return on investment
     
     
    I know it sure costs more to own a boat and fish it regularly compared to shore/creek fishing
    But which group contributes more the  local economy and fish comish coffer$?
     
    Thanks
     
     
    LTA
    #8
    dano
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/17 08:59:43 (permalink)
    genieman77
     
    I know it sure costs more to own a boat and fish it regularly compared to shore/creek fishing
    But which group contributes more the  local economy and fish comish coffer$?
     

     
    I'm not sure,,But,,Here in NY, we dropped the price of all sporting licenses.
    Out of State dropped from $70 to $50.
     NY realized that the impact of high license costs not only resulted in fewer license sales but also negatively impacted the local economies. Increases are counterproductive. 
    Hunters and fishermen contribute millions to the local Walmarts, sporting good stores, restaurants, gas stations, hotels etc..  
    I spend about a grand a year in PA solely to feed my fishing addiction. All Pa taxable.
     
     
    I'm with Chris on the Stamp Fund. There are many closed of to fishing properties that are still waiting for a better $ offer from the PFBC.   
     
     
    #9
    thunderpole
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/17 10:15:25 (permalink)
    I spend lots at the local stores after gas I'm spending probably 20-30$ a trip there sinkers, floats thread beads whatever from the baitshops typically eat at bk in Fairview plus snacks drinks coffee whatever .Creek fisherman dump alot of money locally there. And I'm sure most are like me that's thousands per day easy

    I'd rather be lucky then good,but im to good to be lucky
    #10
    Ironhed
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/17 15:38:53 (permalink)
    dano
     
    http://www.fishandboat.com/Zone1/Documents/SenateBill-1168.pdf
     
    In the proposed license fee schedule, this is listed down below under Other provisions:
                   Broadens Use of Lake Erie Funds for Public Fishing.
     
    Does anyone know what they mean by "BROADER USE"?
     
     
     


    Dan,
    They are trying to change the verbage regarding allocation of stamp funds and what they can be used for.
    It's about time.

    Blacktop Charters
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    Ironhed
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/17 15:42:02 (permalink)
    genieman77
    chrisrowboat
    I've been saying for years they need to increase the amount they will pay per stream mile for easements. "The louder the steelhead fisherman and groups are the more the PAFBC will work in directing those funds". Lake Erie boat fisherman are screaming now but the way the stamp legislation was written it can't  be directed towards it. Boat fund moneys have traditionally been used but the commission sees the amount of of money sitting in the access fund and want into it.
    I've been told this from The Director and by the Commissioners in person.
    Take it for what it is worth.




     
    Hi Chris....good to see you're still involved  and hope you and family are doing well
     
    I've been out of the game so long,  don't know what's been going on.
    What group of anglers contributes most to the local economy ?
    Boaters or creek steelhesders?
     
    If re$ourses are limited, one would think the best use of them would go to the best return on investment
     
     
    I know it sure costs more to own a boat and fish it regularly compared to shore/creek fishing
    But which group contributes more the  local economy and fish comish coffer$?
     
    Thanks
     
     
    LTA




    Larry,
    Boaters spend 4 times the amount money in comparison to stream guys according to the last two economic impact studies.
    It's about time an attempt is made to change the verbage to the law.
     
    -Ken

    Blacktop Charters
    #12
    BeenThereDoneThat.
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/17 16:35:02 (permalink)
    Geez Ken, keep that under your hat, if my wife sees that stat I'll be wading. 🎃

    Give a man a fish and you will feed him for a day; teach a man to fish and you will feed him for a life time. ~Anne Isabella Thackeray Ritchie (1837–1919)~
     
     
     
      Old fisherman never die; we just smell that way. 
     
    #13
    genieman77
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/17 16:36:22 (permalink)
    Thanks Kenney
    Does that mean you get new launches and I get stuck in stop sign hole...
     

     

     
     
    LTA
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    Ironhed
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/17 18:07:59 (permalink)
    Don't tell the wife!!!

    Potentially yes, Larry. I couldn't see something happening of that magnitude for a very long time. But it could mean ramp improvements, fish cleaning stations, etc.

    Blacktop Charters
    #15
    Fisherlady2
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/17 18:23:34 (permalink)
    Ironhed
    Don't tell the wife!!!

    Potentially yes, Larry. I couldn't see something happening of that magnitude for a very long time. But it could mean ramp improvements, fish cleaning stations, etc.

    I have no problems with the stamp money going to improve the experience for either stream or lake fisherman....what worries me is that the funds will be siphoned off for pet projects or benefits which have nothing to do with the Erie watershed. 
     
    The language needs to be reinforced...money collected from a stamp required to fish the watershed should only be used to improve the watershed. Any loopholes allowed to remain in the language will make it a slush fund which will soon be used, abused and it will soon be gone. 
    #16
    dano
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/17 19:15:13 (permalink)
     It Will end up being used for launch maintenance, dredging and other things that were covered under the general fund. 
    #17
    Smallsac
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    Re: Senate Bill 1168 PFBC 2016/10/23 00:52:23 (permalink)
    Two things I would like to see:
     
    1.  A monetary increase in the fines along with an increase in WCO's.  Look at the number of wardens in NY during salmon season vs. Pa in steelhead season.  Large amount of revenue being left on the table, would also clean up the unsavory elements.
    2.  A special conservation stamp/button/license, that must be displayed (ie. orange vs yellow license); at a minimal reduced cost of the current license (5%).  That would permit the angler to harvest only one fish, in the case of a mortally wounded fish.  Would add peer pressure to support catch n release.
    #18
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