flyrod help

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1mocast
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2015/01/03 08:46:54 (permalink)

flyrod help

What is a good wt.fly rod for Erie steel head ??
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    pikepredator2
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/03 09:37:09 (permalink)
    you're going to get alot of different opinions on this.  I love my 8 wt.  I can get 'em in quick and my arm doesn't tire like it would using a stouter 9 or 10 wt.  Lighter weight rods, 6 and under, forces you to play a fish longer, almost to the point of exhaustion and much to the ire of other fishermen around you.  Saw the upper section of a 6 wt snap on Elk a few years back.  Personally speaking I wouldn't go with less than a 7 wt.  
    #2
    KJH807
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/03 09:52:35 (permalink)
    the wt of the rod is less important on your ability to play/control/land fish.
    6wt-8wt is plenty



    #3
    pikepredator2
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/03 13:11:46 (permalink)
    but with all the talk of catch and release on this site, the goal is to get that fish in quick and not play him to exhaustion.  if you want to use a lighter weight rod to enhance the fight that's fine and totally your business.  I for one am not a C & R fisherman.  never have been, never will be.  I use what I catch.  Plus I cited a study on northern pike a while back in In-Fisherman magazine that proves that the practice of catch and release over and over again affects the fish's growth, feeding habits, reproductive habits and longevity.  and these trout are alot more fragile than any northern.  but I'm hijacking this thread and didn't mean to.  sorry.
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    1mocast
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/03 20:12:01 (permalink)
    Thanks all
    #5
    cbeagler
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/04 08:00:14 (permalink)
    Just one more thought, there are some 6 weights as heavy as an 8 weight, and some 8 weights as heavy as a 6. As far as carrying and casting all day you may want to consider this. compare for comfort among brands and weights. 

     

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    Youghman
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/05 10:34:10 (permalink)
    A 7wt. for Erie steelies is the way to go. Not too big-not too small.
    The reel is the key.
    You've got to have a good reel w/ a good adjustable drag that allows you to change and control the amount of drag while playing the fish.
    The reel and drag system is what fights the fish, not the rod.
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    KJH807
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/05 11:35:52 (permalink)
    pikepredator2
    but with all the talk of catch and release on this site, the goal is to get that fish in quick and not play him to exhaustion.  if you want to use a lighter weight rod to enhance the fight that's fine and totally your business.  I for one am not a C & R fisherman.  never have been, never will be.  I use what I catch.  Plus I cited a study on northern pike a while back in In-Fisherman magazine that proves that the practice of catch and release over and over again affects the fish's growth, feeding habits, reproductive habits and longevity.  and these trout are alot more fragile than any northern.  but I'm hijacking this thread and didn't mean to.  sorry.



    Disagree 100%
    I can safely and effectively land with a 6wt... to the point where you tail them in 12in of water and you can barely get the hook out of their mouth before they rip away
    the problem is people don't know how to fight a fish
     
     
    DONT - stand in one spot with your rod high and  at 90* or more... you are just supporting the fish and letting them rest
    turn the fish, apply side pressure, keep your rod tip low, don't let them rest, never bring the rod past 90* (70-80 is too much)
     
    Rods can take A LOT... don't baby them
     
     
    the pike thing is completely irrelevant to erie steelhead 
     
    Youghman
    ...
    You've got to have a good reel w/ a good adjustable drag that allows you to change and control the amount of drag while playing the fish.
    The reel and drag system is what fights the fish, not the rod.




    no
    never touch the drag while fighting a fish... #1 to loose them
    set your drag an leave it
     
    All of my steelhead reels have NO DRAG
    there is no need to stop a running fish (esp in Erie streams... where are they going to go??), just have enough to ensure you don't back lash
     
    the pressure, leverage, and turning of the fish with the rod fights the fish
    post edited by KJH807 - 2015/01/05 11:38:06



    #8
    Youghman
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/05 18:02:08 (permalink)
    Side pressure is very important and greatly helps in fighting the fish.
    The rod does work by putting pressure, leverage and direction to the fish.
    'where are they going to go??'
    Erie steelies can go a far as they want to, when you don't use the correct
    techniques. 
    For me, personally, that includes a good drag set.
    Not too tight, not too loose.
    #9
    pikepredator2
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/06 06:49:43 (permalink)
    KJH, why would you say the study on the northern pike is completely irrelevant to erie steelhead?  the only irrelevant point in the study that would apply here is how C & R affects a steelhead's reproductive capacity as we don't have any way to measure that on our local steel.  Everything else would hold true (feeding, growth, etc), and I believe to a greater effect on the more fragile steelhead.  This study was done in Germany on local pike and lakes.  Are you also saying that the results of that study would not hold true on the pike in the U.S.(or could be extrapolated to include other fish species)?  If so, why? A pike is a pike, and catch and release is catch and release.  I seriously doubt that Europeans have different methods of fighting/playing/releasing their fish.  One of the conclusions to this study that can be drawn is that C & R is not as innocuous as we all thought and that there are far reaching effects to the fish once he has been released back into the water, no matter how carefully and quickly we do this.  Up to this point we all assumed that once released, the fish went on their merry way and suffered no longer lasting ill effects.  This study shed some light proving that just isn't the case.
    #10
    Porktown
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/06 08:46:39 (permalink)
    A pike is not a steelhead.  Saying what is good/bad for a pike is the same for a steelhead is assuming a lot.  They are both fish, that is it.  What is good/bad for a spider monkey is not good/bad for a human.  There are plenty of studies on trout & steelhead, that suggest if proper techniques are used, C&R is relatively effective.  Will some of those same issues that they noted in pike occur, possibly, but until the same study is done on Erie steelhead, it is all assumption.  Much as what many other studies of steelhead from Pacific NW or trout from Montana.  If test conditions are completely different, then the same results can only be assumed.
     
    I think only a complete fool would think C&R does absolutely nothing negative to a fish.  That said, unless they are stomped on, gill raked, and left out of the water for an extended period of time (or done multiple times every day for 4-6 months), they are mostly better off than being roped.
     
    I'm definitely not an advocate of either C&R or keeping everything.  If I catch a perch, crappie, walleye or many other species of legal size, 9 times out of 10, it is going in a cooler and home to meet my skillet/oven/grill.  I'm a fish eater, and buy fish when it's Winter and out.  If I happen to steelhead fish that year, I'll usually keep a fish or two per year for the smoker, but I don't have issue releasing others.  I release most other large predatory fish that I catch.  I do my best to control the fish in water and unhook it, seemingly off to be hooked 2-3 more times that day for the next 3 months if caught in the Erie tribs...  If your point was that Erie trib circusheads are better off being roped, due to the abuse they take, even from the best C&R techniques, I'd completely agree.
    #11
    pikepredator2
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/07 10:01:14 (permalink)
    no pork, but if you put a human or a spider monkey through trauma or stress time and time again, it's going to have long lasting effects.  this is well documented in humans and its silly to think that it wouldn't apply to lesser vertebrates.  my point to the post is that C & R isn't the totally harmless practice that we thought it was and it does have longer lasting effects after the fish is released.  I googled C & R studies and alot of them reported the varying percentages of mortality rates in various freshwater fish species due to catch and release.  unfortunately that's all they reported, but the German study went further and examined the effects on feeding, growth, reproduction, etc. along with mortality.
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    KJH807
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/07 10:30:45 (permalink)
    since this thread as going off the track...
     
    pikepredator2
    ...a study on northern pike a while back in In-Fisherman magazine that proves that the practice of catch and release over and over again affects the fish's growth, feeding habits, reproductive habits and longevity...


    resident naturally occurring population VS 99.999% artifical population
    Apples VS oranges
     
     
    growth - they grow in a raceway at their most fragile time and then in the lake 
    Feeding habits - they eat in a raceway and then in the lake
    reproduction - void
    longevity - void (unless you are taking about "longevity" over the fall-spring season)
     
    its artificially engineered migratory population managed for harvest of returning fish knowing that the next season new fish will come
     
    not a naturally occurring or even naturally reproducing population, that supports a "natural number" of fish ... they are not resident long-lived fish that support a fishery over a 15-20year live span... stocking replenishes year after year...there are fish from 3 year classes in the stream as adults (never seen a true study of multiple run fish) but i'd venture that a multiple return fish is a rarity, not the norm.
     
     
    post edited by KJH807 - 2015/01/07 10:33:12



    #13
    pikepredator2
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/07 16:53:26 (permalink)
    "15-20 year life span".  not if they're caught and released several dozen times.  And that's my point.  I don't care if the fish was born and spent his entire life in the tribs/lake or was conceived artificially and spent the first year of his life in a raceway.  The trauma and stress of repetitive C & R affects the fish after we see him swim away. PERIOD
    #14
    KJH807
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/08 10:15:00 (permalink)
    pikepredator2
    ... C & R affects the fish after we see him swim away...


    i don't think anyone is debating that
     
    its just the the "pike study" has little to no similarities/ relevance to LE steelbows



    #15
    fisherofmen376
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/08 21:39:20 (permalink)
    And that's why a 3 weight is plenty big enough for steelies.
    And elk is wider that the yough.

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    #16
    Porktown
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/09 11:46:21 (permalink)
    Just heard that Sportsman's Warehouse is planning to close.
    #17
    jaydse
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/09 21:10:48 (permalink)
    fisherofmen376
    And elk is wider that the yough.

    where ??

    Mercury jet, & Tohotsu prop.  Lowes boat, ST. Croix poles Shimano reels .
    #18
    fisherofmen376
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/10 09:19:36 (permalink)
    Lol it's kind of a joke. Some jagoff (pittsburgh term meaning jerk) once tried to make a comparison between a relatively wide section of elk and the yough. Some idiot I'm guessing ;).
    And pork, can u indeed confirm the closing of such an amazing retail establishment??? I've been shopping there since I was a lad.

    "Come, follow me," Jesus said, "and I will make you fishers of men."
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    #19
    KJH807
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/10 09:34:45 (permalink)
    that one section of elk down from the new sportsman's warehouse... way bigger than the yough 



    #20
    fisherofmen376
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/10 23:38:25 (permalink)
    Just need pxatim to chime in now for a complete burn....

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    #21
    Guest
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/10 23:43:48 (permalink)
    i heard sportsman's warehouse is opening in erie next week.  they've the best prices on blue power bait.
     
    #22
    fisherofmen376
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/11 17:19:58 (permalink)
    It's actually spelled pahher bait. Nnat.

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    #23
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/11 21:35:08 (permalink)
    i'm from the flatlands, alex, and everyone knows we talk funny because we follow the browns.
     
    #24
    tim from harrisburg
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/12 08:39:17 (permalink)
    The yough is the new old 20 mile
    #25
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/12 15:58:56 (permalink)
    does rt. 5 cross the yough and are the salmon up that far yet?
     
    post edited by rap - 2015/01/12 18:14:06
    #26
    DarDys
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/12 17:26:22 (permalink)
    No but the bonefish are. Don't tell anyone.

    The poster formally known as Duncsdad

    Everything I say can be fully substantiated by my own opinion.
    #27
    Chris Johnson
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/12 17:31:11 (permalink)
    Just between us, ... the rustheads are up to 22 in the 'hannah.
    #28
    fisherofmen376
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/12 21:51:29 (permalink)
    There's Timmay!!!!

    "Come, follow me," Jesus said, "and I will make you fishers of men."
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    #29
    pikepredator2
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    Re: flyrod help 2015/01/14 06:51:01 (permalink)
    Timmay!!!   too funny
    #30
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